Urgent lubrication question

[josbeat]

hi!
ok I have the dry sump sytem working with crank scraper and Pauter rods
how is the pistons lubricated and cylinder walls?
the pauter rods dont have the oil hole on the side , the scraper clean the crankshaft of oil and the oil jets only work at certain oil pressure so .... how ????

 

[Nick M]

If you have a GE, you don't have the pistons to squirt oil on the underside. If the Pauter rod does not have holes in it, then you will not have any lubrication besides the crank splash. Something to think about...I know, too late now.

 

[josbeat]

is the GTE so yes it have oil squirters but if I remember well they only spray under certain oil pressure.
on the scraper site they say that the crank send a lot of oil from the bearings to the walls but our supras also have a hole on the rods to send oil to the pistons if the Pauter rods dont have that hole ..... will be sufficient lubrication with the oil hows coming out from the crank bearings?? soon will we know
at the moment sound´s good
other way will be setting the minimum oil pressure to keep the squirters spraying all the time, with the dry sump system its possible but only if is necessary.

good to have opinions please.

 

[josbeat]

at the moment I got 2 Kg oil pressure at idle when cold and 3 kg when is hot which is rare , idling a 1000 rev with 10w60 Castrol oil

 

[Nick M]

the scraper site they say that the crank send a lot of oil from the bearings to the walls but our supras also have a hole on the rods to send oil to the pistons

All production engines pump oil through the crankshaft to the journals. And there is a hole and passage in the rod to squirt oil on the cylinder wall. Not the piston. This is why pistons have oil control rings. To wipe away the excess and minimize oil burning through the four stroke process. All normal running engines burn oil, despite people saying their dipstick shows full and they don't burn oil. The squirters are there because the rod does not shoot oil straight up.

if the Pauter rods dont have that hole

Then there will be a lot of friction on the cylinder walls, increasing wear and reducing power. I don't have those rods. Maybe IJ has a picture in his archive thread. It seems odd to me that they would not have the channel for lubrication.

The squirters do need certain pressure to over come the spring that holds it shut.

 

[Nick M]

idling a 1000 rev with 10w60 Castrol oil

Group 4 or 5 synthetic? 60 grade needs a lot of heat to flow properly.

 

[atmperformance]

that's so seriously heavy oil

 

[IJ.]

Should have had slots machined into the flanks of the Big end of the rods to spray onto the cylinder walls on the thrust side of the block.

 

[Dan_Gyoba]

is the GTE

Am I the only one who finds it odd that this was posted in the GE section then?

So far as I know, the crank should never be splashing in the oil, splash comes from the oil which is forced out the sides of the piston wrist pins and crank journals from the oil pressure of the pump. A scraper may reduce this somewhat from the journals, but not from the wrist pins at all.

Anyway, if this has the squirters, then it should be okay.

 

[josbeat]

Should have had slots machined into the flanks of the Big end of the rods to spray onto the cylinder walls on the thrust side of the block.

yes it shoudl but I dont remember to see anything
aslo I tried to see if they have possition marks or any instalation instructions but nopp nothing
at the moment still runnign well , i have checked the camshaft journals and still perfect

 

[josbeat]

Group 4 or 5 synthetic? 60 grade needs a lot of heat to flow properly.

maybe there it have that information bur here in Europa i cant see any information about the grade
it only say 10w60 Castrol Edge especial for BMW M series Engines

My supra is for racing purpose and it is the best oil I used with it with forged piston ectr.

 

[Nick M]

10w60 is a grading system developed by the Society of Automotive Engineers to help complicate owners thoughts on oil, because C and S for diesel and gas from the API wasn't confusing enough. C and S do have a legitimate reason, but unless you have read it, you might not get it.

So 10W is a grade.

 

[jdmfreak]

Whats the point in running such a thick oil?? Some people swear by 20w50 while others swear by 0w30 I run 5w20 and you're running 10w60

 

[josbeat]

10w60 is a grading system developed by the Society of Automotive Engineers to help complicate owners thoughts on oil, because C and S for diesel and gas from the API wasn't confusing enough. C and S do have a legitimate reason, but unless you have read it, you might not get it.

So 10W is a grade.

sorry I want to say Group about the question of which is the group four or five.

 

[josbeat]

Whats the point in running such a thick oil?? Some people swear by 20w50 while others swear by 0w30 I run 5w20 and you're running 10w60

here it is very popular for racing cars and it is made special for large engine claerances with forged pistons
it is very good to lower the oil consumption on a racing engines
but the best is because the oil film is very resistance at high temperatures
it have a lot of good chemicals aditives

I have a lot of storys with that oil and all are good, I dont understand the surprise to use Castrol 10w60 , is the best and recomended for supras , it cure oil pressure problems and oil consumptions

for example is you have a BMW M3 or M5 is the only oil you can put it in because if not you will need to put more oil into the engie than fuel in the tank every 60 Miles

anyway everyone have his preferences and only the experience tells the truth.

 

[Bmettie]

Am I the only one who finds it odd that this was posted in the GE section then?

So far as I know, the crank should never be splashing in the oil, splash comes from the oil which is forced out the sides of the piston wrist pins and crank journals from the oil pressure of the pump. A scraper may reduce this somewhat from the journals, but not from the wrist pins at all.

Anyway, if this has the squirters, then it should be okay.

OEM Pistons do not have pump feed wrist pins, wrist pin lubrication comes from the oil control rings on the piston, which pushes oil onto the pin next to the locks. Also from the oil squirters, the underside of a OEM cast piston has hashmarks for the oil to collect on(with the squirter open, and as the piston comes down the bore) then drip down a hole on the very top of the rod feeding the wrist pin. The squirter is also for piston cooling on turbo cars. I'm curious how much oil is "spraying" out of the big end of the rod pins on the crank, and is it enough to soak the cylinder walls when piston is all the way up. Basically are the squirters needed on a forged bottom end with no rod sprayers?

 

[IJ.]

yes it shoudl but I dont remember to see anything
aslo I tried to see if they have possition marks or any instalation instructions but nopp nothing
at the moment still runnign well , i have checked the camshaft journals and still perfect

With a scraper unless you have 40+ Psi Hot idle pressure you're running the risk of increased Piston/ring/pin wear...

 

[Poodles]

at the moment I got 2 Kg oil pressure at idle when cold and 3 kg when is hot which is rare , idling a 1000 rev with 10w60 Castrol oil

It's just about impossible for the pressure to go UP with a hot idle...

Also, I get into these arguments all the time at work about heavier oils being "better." For starters, there's pressure relief valves in the oil pump...

 

[Nick M]

sorry I want to say Group about the question of which is the group four or five.

Group 4 and 5 are not made from crude oil base stock. Most are made from hydrocracking the crude oil. Most being Mobil 1, Castrol, Penzoil... they all work really well, but not as well as a group 4 or 5.

 

[josbeat]

It's just about impossible for the pressure to go UP with a hot idle...

Also, I get into these arguments all the time at work about heavier oils being "better." For starters, there's pressure relief valves in the oil pump...

the idle when cold wasnt smoth than when hot with the new 272 camshaft so may be that was the mistake also everything was new included the oil pump .
now with better idling speed and after a little breaking in all is normal , but is truth taht the presure is practical indentical when cold and when hot but this is one of the avantages of the Castrol 10w60.