I know this post looks huge but I NEED YOU ALL to read this!!!
Good Evening folks, most of you don’t know me but I have an issue here that I need to get off my chest and make you all aware of. First off let me just fill you in on some minor details: I am a very very small time vendor who concentrates all my sales on the MK2 community and the local (Toronto) MK3 community. I have my reasons but for the most part I have been avoiding even attempting sales or ‘showing my face’ to the international MK3 community but something has happened in the last little while which requires me to “come out of hiding”.
There was a particular thread on this very forum about a Divorced Downpipe that people were concerned about. In case you need to refresh your memory this is the thread that I am talking about:
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27391
Those of you who posted and read this thread know what it’s about it. For those of you who have never read it before I’ll save you the time and give you the short version:
This post in that thread clearly states that the item in question was marketed by an individual by the name of Zoon: http://www.supramania.com/forums/showpost.php?p=349880&postcount=16
By searching the forum memberlist his information can be found here:
http://www.supramania.com/forums/member.php?u=900
Clearly this person is from the USA…I’m not sure if anyone here has noticed but it is clearly stated in my profile in this forum and Toyota Nation that I am from Toronto…FYI…for those of you who don’t know that’s in Canada!
Now…it bothers every fibre inside me that I now I have to come on this forum and justify MYSELF to everyone. You guys obviously don’t know me from Adam unless you also browse through www.celicasupra.com which I happen to moderate and sponsor. My reputation means more to me than every dollar you all have in your pocket and that is the ONLY reason I humiliating myself to explain this to you all.
To give you some background I was doing research many years ago on a turbo set up that I wanted for my MK2: twin hks gt2535’s. This brought me to attention of 300zx forum where I did a lot of reading and talking to individuals. All these individuals were running divorced downpipes and some even made custom ddp flanges for the gt2535 turbo’s which I thought at the time was ingenious as I had not heard of this concept before.
Being a vendor in the MK2 community I thought it would be a perfect mod for the MK2 and put up this thread way back in August of 2004 after doing some research:
http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?t=8244&highlight=divorced
At this point in time I saw NO benefit to even attempting one for the MK3 as Randy already had a fine product to offer but his product would NOT fit a MK2.
So I ventured out to have my own built with this being the prototype MK2 unit that was fabricated last year:
My accusers have failed to do their research…if I bought Randy’s unit only to send it overseas to copy it why in the world would I have paid a local fabricator to prototype one on a customers car. My intentions were to test the product on the mk2 market and possibly in the future the MK3 market. I had a DDP made for my mk3 last year but after blowing up my motor in September it’s been sitting in my garage collecting dust.
Something else that’s bothering me: there is also an individual in that post who feels his ‘design’ was copied. All I have to say to that is: I do my best to avoid Supraforums and Supramania….this individuals ‘design’ is the last thing I would see surfing these forums. I really can’t understand why everyone jumps on the “my design was copied” bandwagon. Common folks…it’s Divorced Downpipe for crying out loud…NOBODY has the patents on it; NOBODY on here is an originator and these things have been around since long before your parents were in diapers!!! If 20 fabricators were each given a MK3 to build a re-routed Divorced Downpipe beyond a couple of minor details they will all look almost exactly the same. I choose to smoothen the transition of the re-entry compared to what Randy did…it’s not rocket science. There are really only 2 ways to re-route the pipe: at or close to a 90 degree angle like Randy’s or a more gradual entry…how one person can claim ownership of that design accusing others of having copied them is way beyond my comprehension…you’d think we were talking about the cure for cancer here!!
I have stated this in my reply to the individual on Toyota Nation: I am NOT a fabricator; I have never welded and I have never ever once in any thread on any forum said that I built these with my bare hands!! I have never lied to anyone about my products or tried to make them something they are not!! Why is that problem to some people?? Why am I not allowed to sell something just because another individual makes them with his bare hands? Why do you all assume something made from overseas is that crap?? Have you seen them?? Have you tested them…I know I have?? Did you ask me what lengths I went through to try to get my pipes done locally in Canada and in the US? Did you ask me how many useless hours I spent talking to company’s that wouldn’t give me the time of day unless I was throwing thousands of dollars their way?? I wanted a product to sell to the MK2 community and I’m sorry but overseas was the ONLY solution I found. If you guys have a better solution I’m all ears and would love to hear it...PM me ANYTIME!! Why people like me and other vendors have to explain to you why we are making things overseas is beyond me: If you don’t like it DON’T buy it …your loss!!
I have only been in business for a couple of years; but in those couple of years my #1 concern has and will always be my customer’s satisfaction and my reputation. Money is faaar distant 2nd place. I have nothing to hide from my accusers or anyone on these forums. I encourage each and everyone of you to put up a post on www.celicasupra.com and ask the individuals there how important my reputation is to me. Ask individuals who bought MK2 DDP’s off me that had fitment issues what I did. Ask them if they were happy with the fact that I went out and had hand built for them temporary downpipes so they can get up and running with 0 downtime at a HUGE loss to myself. As embarrassing as that is to admit I’m letting you all now as anyone who is stupid enough to loose hundreds of dollars in a sale to save his reputation will NOT go out and copy someone’s design.
I feel like throwing up just for the fact that I have to come on here and explain myself to people that I consider my peers. I’m sorry this has been so long and I appreciate more than you can know that you’ve read this far as I’m sure only a couple of you did. I did not come here to solicit sales…I have NOTHING to offer you. I came here to save my reputation as a vendor…a pretty small vendor yes but my reputation is ALL I have.
I’m so sorry that individuals do not give it any thought before they come onto an open forum to slander somebody. To be honest with you I am not surprised and it’s the reason I will probably never attempt sales on this or any other similar forum. My whole day is WASTED dealing with this issue; time is very precious to me as this is only a part time thing for me. I have a full time job and it’s so irritating that I had to waste a whole day on this.
Randy if you have any questions or concerns I would be glad to talk to you; it’s been my intention from the beginning to never step on your toes. You are probably in my eyes one of the most valuable members of the Supra Community and I have a great amount of respect for you. I hope that what ever I have said or done has not created any hard feelings.
Peace to you all….thanks!!!
PS…forgive me if there were any spelling or grammatical error’s...proof reading was not #1 on my priority list for this post!!
Good Evening folks, most of you don’t know me but I have an issue here that I need to get off my chest and make you all aware of. First off let me just fill you in on some minor details: I am a very very small time vendor who concentrates all my sales on the MK2 community and the local (Toronto) MK3 community. I have my reasons but for the most part I have been avoiding even attempting sales or ‘showing my face’ to the international MK3 community but something has happened in the last little while which requires me to “come out of hiding”.
There was a particular thread on this very forum about a Divorced Downpipe that people were concerned about. In case you need to refresh your memory this is the thread that I am talking about:
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27391
Those of you who posted and read this thread know what it’s about it. For those of you who have never read it before I’ll save you the time and give you the short version:
- It was determined that somebody had purchased a DDP from BIC
- This person sent this DDP out immediately to get copied in order to profit from it’s design
- This post in that thread points everyone to a thread that I started at ToyotaNation: http://www.supramania.com/forums/showpost.php?p=353694&postcount=48
- That Toyota Nation thread can be found here: http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/t118950.html where things really get ugly on page 3
This post in that thread clearly states that the item in question was marketed by an individual by the name of Zoon: http://www.supramania.com/forums/showpost.php?p=349880&postcount=16
By searching the forum memberlist his information can be found here:
http://www.supramania.com/forums/member.php?u=900
Clearly this person is from the USA…I’m not sure if anyone here has noticed but it is clearly stated in my profile in this forum and Toyota Nation that I am from Toronto…FYI…for those of you who don’t know that’s in Canada!
Now…it bothers every fibre inside me that I now I have to come on this forum and justify MYSELF to everyone. You guys obviously don’t know me from Adam unless you also browse through www.celicasupra.com which I happen to moderate and sponsor. My reputation means more to me than every dollar you all have in your pocket and that is the ONLY reason I humiliating myself to explain this to you all.
To give you some background I was doing research many years ago on a turbo set up that I wanted for my MK2: twin hks gt2535’s. This brought me to attention of 300zx forum where I did a lot of reading and talking to individuals. All these individuals were running divorced downpipes and some even made custom ddp flanges for the gt2535 turbo’s which I thought at the time was ingenious as I had not heard of this concept before.
Being a vendor in the MK2 community I thought it would be a perfect mod for the MK2 and put up this thread way back in August of 2004 after doing some research:
http://forums.celicasupra.com/showthread.php?t=8244&highlight=divorced
At this point in time I saw NO benefit to even attempting one for the MK3 as Randy already had a fine product to offer but his product would NOT fit a MK2.
So I ventured out to have my own built with this being the prototype MK2 unit that was fabricated last year:
My accusers have failed to do their research…if I bought Randy’s unit only to send it overseas to copy it why in the world would I have paid a local fabricator to prototype one on a customers car. My intentions were to test the product on the mk2 market and possibly in the future the MK3 market. I had a DDP made for my mk3 last year but after blowing up my motor in September it’s been sitting in my garage collecting dust.
Something else that’s bothering me: there is also an individual in that post who feels his ‘design’ was copied. All I have to say to that is: I do my best to avoid Supraforums and Supramania….this individuals ‘design’ is the last thing I would see surfing these forums. I really can’t understand why everyone jumps on the “my design was copied” bandwagon. Common folks…it’s Divorced Downpipe for crying out loud…NOBODY has the patents on it; NOBODY on here is an originator and these things have been around since long before your parents were in diapers!!! If 20 fabricators were each given a MK3 to build a re-routed Divorced Downpipe beyond a couple of minor details they will all look almost exactly the same. I choose to smoothen the transition of the re-entry compared to what Randy did…it’s not rocket science. There are really only 2 ways to re-route the pipe: at or close to a 90 degree angle like Randy’s or a more gradual entry…how one person can claim ownership of that design accusing others of having copied them is way beyond my comprehension…you’d think we were talking about the cure for cancer here!!
I have stated this in my reply to the individual on Toyota Nation: I am NOT a fabricator; I have never welded and I have never ever once in any thread on any forum said that I built these with my bare hands!! I have never lied to anyone about my products or tried to make them something they are not!! Why is that problem to some people?? Why am I not allowed to sell something just because another individual makes them with his bare hands? Why do you all assume something made from overseas is that crap?? Have you seen them?? Have you tested them…I know I have?? Did you ask me what lengths I went through to try to get my pipes done locally in Canada and in the US? Did you ask me how many useless hours I spent talking to company’s that wouldn’t give me the time of day unless I was throwing thousands of dollars their way?? I wanted a product to sell to the MK2 community and I’m sorry but overseas was the ONLY solution I found. If you guys have a better solution I’m all ears and would love to hear it...PM me ANYTIME!! Why people like me and other vendors have to explain to you why we are making things overseas is beyond me: If you don’t like it DON’T buy it …your loss!!
I have only been in business for a couple of years; but in those couple of years my #1 concern has and will always be my customer’s satisfaction and my reputation. Money is faaar distant 2nd place. I have nothing to hide from my accusers or anyone on these forums. I encourage each and everyone of you to put up a post on www.celicasupra.com and ask the individuals there how important my reputation is to me. Ask individuals who bought MK2 DDP’s off me that had fitment issues what I did. Ask them if they were happy with the fact that I went out and had hand built for them temporary downpipes so they can get up and running with 0 downtime at a HUGE loss to myself. As embarrassing as that is to admit I’m letting you all now as anyone who is stupid enough to loose hundreds of dollars in a sale to save his reputation will NOT go out and copy someone’s design.
I feel like throwing up just for the fact that I have to come on here and explain myself to people that I consider my peers. I’m sorry this has been so long and I appreciate more than you can know that you’ve read this far as I’m sure only a couple of you did. I did not come here to solicit sales…I have NOTHING to offer you. I came here to save my reputation as a vendor…a pretty small vendor yes but my reputation is ALL I have.
I’m so sorry that individuals do not give it any thought before they come onto an open forum to slander somebody. To be honest with you I am not surprised and it’s the reason I will probably never attempt sales on this or any other similar forum. My whole day is WASTED dealing with this issue; time is very precious to me as this is only a part time thing for me. I have a full time job and it’s so irritating that I had to waste a whole day on this.
Randy if you have any questions or concerns I would be glad to talk to you; it’s been my intention from the beginning to never step on your toes. You are probably in my eyes one of the most valuable members of the Supra Community and I have a great amount of respect for you. I hope that what ever I have said or done has not created any hard feelings.
Peace to you all….thanks!!!
PS…forgive me if there were any spelling or grammatical error’s...proof reading was not #1 on my priority list for this post!!
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