Throttle Response, momentary hesitation between throttle and power

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
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OC, NY
I dont know if this is natural for all supra's or if its just my throttle linkage or fuel system and this is kind of hard to put into words.

When my car is warm and idling, or when driving at a normal RPM say 2500 in 3rd gear, there is a noticeable approximately near 1 second hesitation between when the intake will suck in air and when the car will actually accelerate. Everything that I've done so far to try and diagnose this is, clean entire intake system manifold to filter, clean cold start injector, inspect and electrical tests on TPS, inspect and test ISC valve, clean and test ACIS, inspect every injector and injector clip, new plugs, wires and ignitor.

Things I did not check are 1) the fuel pressure regulator, TSRM and haynes manual show no way of testing this to see if it is working as normal, 2) the throttle linkage system, it is quite confusing and again the TSRM and haynes have very limited detail pictures of this and no true way of detailing of what to use to clean/lubricate the springs and how to make the throttle linkage operate more smooth.

If anyone can shed some light on what may be the problem giving me what seems such a significant delay for my motor to rev after throttle is engaged or a way to clean and adjust the throttle linkage for maximum response. One thing I've noted from reading around is that supra's have heavy pedals and my pedal is pretty damn light I must say. Thanks.
 

Moy

It's broken...
Aug 6, 2008
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Beach Park, IL
When you press the gas pedal, does it feel floppy and then grab? (Floppy as in there is no tension on the cable)
 

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
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0
OC, NY
Getting code 41: Throttle Position Sensor Signal - Open or short circuit in throttle position sensor signal (VTA) /// a) TPS circuit b) TPS c) ECU

My ECU is new and replaced the obvious bad one so the error must lie between the TPS and the connector. My TPS connector is shredded to bits and barely hangs on to the TPS which is probably not transmitting proper signal. Which means that I would need a new harness clipping for the TPS and/or new TPS. Funny because the TPS passed all resistance checks and if anyone has that harness clipping let me know pre-89 GE.

Could this be the reasoning for my throttle response issues?

---------- Post added at 04:00 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:59 PM ----------


Moy;1567364 said:
When you press the gas pedal, does it feel floppy and then grab? (Floppy as in there is no tension on the cable)

No, not really the throttle linkage is very tight, it just hesitates from when I push the pedal in until when the car will actually rev. I took a video, I just gotta figure out how to edit it and find a host now lol.
 

ValgeKotkas

Supramania Contributor
Apr 14, 2006
2,224
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Over the pond
You have a N/A - everything after 1st gear is one big hesitation :D
Could you make the TPS clip hold on with two zip ties (so was mine made - one goes around the clip, the second one over TPS holding by the first ziptie)? Just a suggestion.
 

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
0
0
OC, NY
zip ties, i didnt even think about that, yet i've use them on alot of things. i've been using electrical tape but it gets warm and slides all over the place, i'm about to go check my other motor because I may have a harness clipping on it, if not i'll try zip ties until I can get a working clip.

i adjusted the accerator cable that controls your idle and it seems to have cured both the high idle and the response issues. we'll see for now.
 

Poodles

I play with fire
Jul 22, 2006
16,757
0
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42
Fort Worth, TX
86.5ny;1567371 said:
Getting code 41: Throttle Position Sensor Signal - Open or short circuit in throttle position sensor signal (VTA) /// a) TPS circuit b) TPS c) ECU

My ECU is new and replaced the obvious bad one so the error must lie between the TPS and the connector. My TPS connector is shredded to bits and barely hangs on to the TPS which is probably not transmitting proper signal. Which means that I would need a new harness clipping for the TPS and/or new TPS. Funny because the TPS passed all resistance checks and if anyone has that harness clipping let me know pre-89 GE.

Could this be the reasoning for my throttle response issues?

New ECU? WHy did you think the ECU was bad? And yes a TPS out of adjustment will cause hesitation...
 

supraduper

New Member
Jun 7, 2009
126
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merrimack nh
the linkage tend to wear out... -NOTE- the bracket thats behind the TB where the throttle cable and cruise connect on a wheel that, in turn, pushes the rod to the actual TB... that wheel has nylon bushings that wear out and cause the lower piece to rub on the bracket itself.... i am sorry i dont have a pic to show you and i may not be the most descriptive.. but this had bothered me.. on my car... look to see if theres rubbing marks under the spring loaded linkage where the cables connect to... good luck
 

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
0
0
OC, NY
Poodles;1567439 said:
New ECU? WHy did you think the ECU was bad? And yes a TPS out of adjustment will cause hesitation...

The ECU was destroyed electrically due to a mishap on my motor swap a couple years ago so I replaced it (I think that it kept blowing the EFI fuse or one of the fusible links, so I did testing it failed, I replaced). Good news is that I went through all my parts and found the harness clipping that came with my new motor and it has a fresh connector for the TPS. So now I know that when I splice that connector in and the code 41 is still showing that it is the actual TPS that is at fault (though the resistance specs from the TSRM correspond with my TPS at its current state.

How exactly does the TPS work? Based on my assumption it alters the ignition timing and fuel injection corresponding to the position of the butterfly valve on the TB, which would cause the hesitation in my case.

supraduper;1567584 said:
the linkage tend to wear out... -NOTE- the bracket thats behind the TB where the throttle cable and cruise connect on a wheel that, in turn, pushes the rod to the actual TB... that wheel has nylon bushings that wear out and cause the lower piece to rub on the bracket itself.... i am sorry i dont have a pic to show you and i may not be the most descriptive.. but this had bothered me.. on my car... look to see if theres rubbing marks under the spring loaded linkage where the cables connect to... good luck

I know exactly what you are talking about and the bushings are intact. One thing that I am having difficulty finding, according to the TSRM, where you insert the thickness gauge between the throttle stop screw and lever. The drawings are rather fuzzy and non-detailed and get worse when magnified. Finding this area would help greatly rather than testing the resistance at 0mm.

Another thing that I would like to touch on is the opening of the throttle body manually when the TB is removed from the car. I was unable to open the butterfly valve but maybe 5mm, is this normal? I think that I have the same problem when the TB is on the car while the car is turned off. Thanks for the insight.
 

Poodles

I play with fire
Jul 22, 2006
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Fort Worth, TX
TPS has to be adjusted right (TSRM shows how), also, if the ECU got fried, did you check the harness with a fine tooth comb to make sure it wasn't damaged as well?
 

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
0
0
OC, NY
Poodles;1567707 said:
TPS has to be adjusted right (TSRM shows how), also, if the ECU got fried, did you check the harness with a fine tooth comb to make sure it wasn't damaged as well?

Yes I did check every piece of the harness coming out of the engine bay for melted wires etc.. it was fine (was pretty much forced to because alot of the JDM parts would not accept the USDM electronics and vise versa. The TSRM does not give me enough visual detail to go on as far as testing with a feeler guage, so far i've only been able to test with the throttle fully closed. It is raining, and I was going to add the TPS connector into my harness today as well as oil change, suspension adjustment and tire rotation but all my plans have been foiled. I'm still boggled to whether you can open the throttle to WOT when the TB is off of the car.
 

Poodles

I play with fire
Jul 22, 2006
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42
Fort Worth, TX
Remove the throttlebody off the car, where you need to put the feeling gauge is obvious once you do (plus it's a bitch to do it on the car IMHO)
 

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
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0
OC, NY
Is the position for the feeler gauge directly below where the 2 EGR vacuum hoses run? And also like I said before, I can barely move the throttle to open up the butterfly valve on the TB when it is off of the car, I would expect it to be just as easy as when on the car but yet it WILL NOT budge more than 5mm. The butterfly valve inside the TB is also set on a slight angle, around 5 degrees off of center eyeballing it.
 

86.5ny

New Member
Apr 26, 2010
40
0
0
OC, NY
the problem is solved, all symptoms of hesitation, super high idle, and code 41 were eliminated with the use of the fresh TPS harness connector. now to run a fresh compression test to see if there was any internal damage from the super high idling. also can move onto oil change and sanding the entire body to prep for paint.

expect a build thread mighty soon!