Kai said:
Really? That's it? Yet you participate in an online enthusiast forum... Hmm... Ok, then - I can see why you don't understand why the iPhone might just be a good product.
Iphone, i called it.
- Thread starter Ric
- Start date
Really? That's it? Yet you participate in an online enthusiast forum... Hmm... Ok, then - I can see why you don't understand why the iPhone might just be a good product.
I like it, i like the technical underpinnings, and i like the price of it - doesnt mean i worship it and think i'm above other people, nor do i harp on about how amazing Toyota is.
Thats what apple people are all about. Shinyness over substance.
Thats what apple people are all about. Shinyness over substance.
dugums said:
Thanks for the support.
I'm really surprised how many people are out there who hate on the iPhone. It's funny, because if they think it is too expensive, they don't have to buy it. But it is very simple fact that the iPhone offers features that are either dramatically improved from any other device, or completely unique to it. Yes--there are phones with better camera features, but I for one do not buy a phone to use as a camera except for a quick picture. Yes--there are phones with removable batteries, but the iPhone has such great battery life (better than any competing smartphone, which don't even have similar features), it's not a huge issue.
Things like Instant Messaging could easily be added later--FOR FREE (not confirming or denying we are working on IM specifically). Apple will not be charging for the software updates that are in progress, for bug fixes and feature updates. I can't tell you which features are actually in progress, but obviously we are hard at work making the product the best it can be!
Again, some of these complaints are also completely wrong, such as the 700MB number that Ric pulled out of his ass (it is completely and totally unsubstantiated, so I am astonished he said that, and is the strongest thing that compelled me to reply). The latest public information about the new iTunes 7.3 release also says that users will be able to create ringtones from their songs within iTunes, and use them on their iPhone; that would also make another complaint completely false, but I won't confirm that is possible until after the launch.
So tell me, How is Apple's Browser better then one released in Windows Mobile 6?
WM6 = Flash, Java, Shockwave, and full internet explorer features.
WM6 = Flash, Java, Shockwave, and full internet explorer features.
Still doesnt explain why for $600 you cant be bothered to fit a better camera to it, or a removeable media slot like other phones that cost less than half the price....
Seriously, i hope it fails.
Seriously, i hope it fails.
i have a treo 700wx, and it definitely lacks in a lot of places, but it works for the business related things that it seems to be designed for. how does one get flash and java going on there though?
Kai said:
Well, I don't think I spoke about "worship" or tried to imply that I was better than anyone...?
Anyway - I like my Supra because it looks good (especially when shiny:biglaugh: ) and drives great. I also like "the technical details" -- RWD, I6, turbo, suspension, etc.
I have to say I really don't care about some of the iPhone shortcomings. I guess I have never used ANY phone that I desired to edit word documents or such. I have used many smartphones and I think they all suck as a mini-semi-replacement to a computer -- which is what it seems many of you guys are after.
When it really comes down to it - I only end up using my phone for music, phone calls, and the occasional email check. I understand that there are some people who ABSOLUTELY NEED to use smartphones -- I am not one of them -- I have never felt owning the 'best' smartphone would do anything for me.
To all of you who are knocking the iPhone - you should understand that not everybody needs what you do (or what you think you do). There are plenty who will spend the money to get something that makes them happy - because it does what they need it to (and better than other phones), and is well designed, and yes, beautiful and shiny.
stan said:
Flash? http://www.adobe.com/products/#mobile_devices
Java? On a treo, not going to happen. Java is carrier dependant. Palm did not want Java on the W/WX and is not installable. The phone does not have enough RAM to support multimedia applications, it's stirctly a business phone to compete with the blackberry. The Treo 700 also has a unique substandard 240x240 resolution and many WM5 applications do not work on it. The 700P is far superior.
Ric said:
Comparing Windows Mobile browsing to the implementation of Safari on the iPhone is the real joke, in all honesty. The engine inside the mobile version is nothing like desktop IE, and the rendering quality is much worse. It's hard to debate this in text--just go try one once the hype dies down, and see how it compares to your WM device.
I'm specifically pointing out that the camera is not a big deal. I know it's nothing close to special. It's not supposed to be. The camera on a phone is not intended for, and rarely used for, remotely serious photography. It is a basic image sensor with decent resolution, and that is all Apple pushes it to be. I'm miffed that you complain it doesn't have autofocus and zoom when the camera on a phone is such a negligible point anyway. But, by the way, the image quality has been shown to be improved over most phones.
Why not do it right the first time? Because, man, this product has to be shipped at some point. It has been under FURIOUS development for TWO YEARS. It has dramatic feature improvements beyond anything else available. Many people understand this and are extremely eager to buy it for what it can offer right now, knowing that the creators are still hard at work, and it will improve while they own it--for free. It's just a reality about software development; it's hard, and takes time.
I personally see very little use in creating or editing office documents while mobile. At the least, it is not a feature that should be of huge priority for version 1.0. Keep in mind that Apple is not currently marketing this device to businesses or business-focused users, at all. That could easily change.
How much do you even know about the iPhone? The initial announcement a year ago discussed push email support free from Yahoo. It can push email from other accounts and servers if necessary. But I prefer to simply wake up the device (instant) and check my mail, rather than be notified about every single email that hits my inbox.
SD cards for transfers, huh? The iPhone syncs over USB 2.0, like I would imagine a lot of other phones do, and accordingly is plenty fast. It has both Bluetooth 2.0 EDR, and unlike most phones, 802.11g WiFi. With an iPhone, you aren't going to be actively generating that much data on the phone, so I'm not sure why you would need an SD card for rapid transfers.
I have used the Sidekick extensively, and the iPhone is not even similar. The Sidekick's music features are hilariously useless (like most phones, actually). The operating system, which is in the same class as Palm OS and WM, is pathetic in comparison to the robustness and ability of the full version of OS X that drives the iPhone. If Apple decides to open the platform to third-party development once it can be better secured, the potential for development is incredible--Macintosh application writers can code for the iPhone using the same language and framework style they write great OS X applications with!
Anyway. I think my final point is the device is much more impressive than you care to give credit for (you insist that there are other phones that do more, which only evidences to me that you don't understand all that an iPhone does and how well it does it), and that it will continue to improve at a high rate when we send out each software update. The hardware is amazing: breathtaking screen (too bright for me at maximum), great multitouch operation, very thin and beautiful formfactor, robust and durable construction, long battery life. The software can be changed top to bottom AFTER you buy the device, for free--and that's the thing people should keep in mind. Their iPhone is only going to get better than the one they actually paid for.
Last edited:
Wow, you speak like you work at Microsoft... Just wait for the update guys!!! hahahahaha
Yes, SD for transfer. Send me a 10mb file from one IPhone to another in less then 30 seconds without using a computer.
I know ALOT about the Iphone, I work for Palm.. you're competition.
Push email from Yahoo? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, tell that to my boss. How does it connect to my exchange server? That's all I need to know.
As I said... The Iphone is a toy, and not a very good one. It reminds me of our failure, the original 700w. If you remove the Iphone's pretty GUI, you just removed everything. The phone does two things. It plays music, and makes phone calls. The web is a joke, yeah real internet browsing compared to a Razr, but worse browsing ability then a Windows Mobile phone with all it's 3rd party support like your desktop your posting on.
The Iphone is the first marketed smartphone designed for entertainment purposes, yes. And thats why I call it a 100% failure, because it's lacking a broadband internet connection to support said features. Is that why the ability to purchase music off Itunes is not available? Because it would take 30mins to download one song? And why the heck does it not do MMS??????????
Yes, SD for transfer. Send me a 10mb file from one IPhone to another in less then 30 seconds without using a computer.
I know ALOT about the Iphone, I work for Palm.. you're competition.
Push email from Yahoo? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA, tell that to my boss. How does it connect to my exchange server? That's all I need to know.
As I said... The Iphone is a toy, and not a very good one. It reminds me of our failure, the original 700w. If you remove the Iphone's pretty GUI, you just removed everything. The phone does two things. It plays music, and makes phone calls. The web is a joke, yeah real internet browsing compared to a Razr, but worse browsing ability then a Windows Mobile phone with all it's 3rd party support like your desktop your posting on.
The Iphone is the first marketed smartphone designed for entertainment purposes, yes. And thats why I call it a 100% failure, because it's lacking a broadband internet connection to support said features. Is that why the ability to purchase music off Itunes is not available? Because it would take 30mins to download one song? And why the heck does it not do MMS??????????
All the No's listed are things I dont need or dont want. Also, no keyboard.... yea its called touch screen for a reason.
Of course it will sell, alot, thats not the question. The issue is, people are paying $600 for something that does less then a phone half it's price.
The reason why it will be successful for being so expensive and so feature lacking compared to other smartphones is............
.....It targets the technology trendy market that buy products to be "in". No matter how lacking it is compared to other smartphones it will still be successful, because it's targeted to a market that isn't capable of successfully using a real smartphone. It's removed features are actually a selling point, because it makes it easier to use.
Apple just made a smartphone for dumb people. Congrats, it was a genius idea.
The reason why it will be successful for being so expensive and so feature lacking compared to other smartphones is............
.....It targets the technology trendy market that buy products to be "in". No matter how lacking it is compared to other smartphones it will still be successful, because it's targeted to a market that isn't capable of successfully using a real smartphone. It's removed features are actually a selling point, because it makes it easier to use.
Apple just made a smartphone for dumb people. Congrats, it was a genius idea.
My Windows Mobile PDA/Phone is the XV6700Supraman said:
it has an on-screen keyboard, too.
It also has on-screen handwriting recognition in 3 different forms, depending on what platform you're migrating from.
It has full voice command and dialing over bluetooth or built-in mic and speaker.
It has very high-speed wireless (VZW EvDO).
Even though Apple seems to think it is revolutionary, I can also tap phone numbers in web pages and my phone automatically dials them.
I can use it as a BlueTooth Wireless modem to get my laptop online at DSL speed.
I can use Excell Mobile to create and edit my weekly timesheets. I use Outlook Mobile to connect to my e-mail servers, as well as pop3 Yahoo! and such.
I have a camera with zoom, autofocus, and low light assist, which aslo makes a very handy flashlight.
In the rare event I deplete my battery within a day, I can pop in one of my spares and keep working, I don't have to worry about finding an outlet to plug into or if my laptop has enough power to stay on and charge it.
With my memory card slot, I can easily share hundreds of megabytes of data instantly. I don't have to find a computer to plug in to to retrieve information, that would be gay.
It organizes and plays tons of media in many different audio and video formats.
OMG, it has SO MANY features, need I go on?
What doesn't it have? A super flashy OS that doesn't do anything special.
So what does the iPhone have that my pocket PC doesn't? Why do I have to wait for Apple to get arround to adding features they should have included int he first place before they worried about the "revolutionary" UI?
Ahh, it's nice to be "dumb" .... :icon_razz -- I don't have to complain about phones that I don't like....
Let's say you're right. If a company can simply "target" the dumb crowd with lots of money to spend, and make a product that they will buy -- they shouldn't do it because Ric says it's a POS and a failure because it doesn't live up to his standards? About it?
Hmmm. It sounds like all other phones are the real failures - they have to pack all of those features for less money -- and they won't sell as many..
Let's say you're right. If a company can simply "target" the dumb crowd with lots of money to spend, and make a product that they will buy -- they shouldn't do it because Ric says it's a POS and a failure because it doesn't live up to his standards? About it?
Hmmm. It sounds like all other phones are the real failures - they have to pack all of those features for less money -- and they won't sell as many..
And BTW, I've read in several articles that the list of No's that the OP posted is accurate, so don't bash on him, bash on the magazines and news sites reporting this.