Code 51=Stranded 87

[jetjock]

You just want the car fixed. I understand but don't make our job harder than it is. It's tough enough to do this over the Net. Help us to help you. Do the simple stuff first. Charge the battery or try a jump. Also check all the connections. After that all that's left is the starter.

 

[cuel]

I guess my question was a little vague. I was curious to know if the engine spins faster than normal, like it doesn't have any compression? From the description in your first post, I thought maybe the timing belt jumped when it started, and either broke or stripped some teeth in the process. If that happened, the engine would seem to spin faster than normal.

With the rest of what your saying, though, charge the battery fully, then try again.

 

[Saavedro88]

You just want the car fixed. I understand but don't make our job harder than it is. It's tough enough to do this over the Net. Help us to help you. Do the simple stuff first. Charge the battery or try a jump. Also check all the connections. After that all that's left is the starter.

Jet, tried a jump yesterday, nothing happened... took it into Advance... Toasted. New battery = Life! Thanks for everyone's help on this, and I'm sorry I tried to make it more difficult than it was... But in my defense ( :greddy2: ) I've never heard a dead battery sound like that before... and I've seen batteries sit for longer. Again, I apologize for being a jackass...

I guess my question was a little vague. I was curious to know if the engine spins faster than normal, like it doesn't have any compression? From the description in your first post, I thought maybe the timing belt jumped when it started, and either broke or stripped some teeth in the process. If that happened, the engine would seem to spin faster than normal.

With the rest of what your saying, though, charge the battery fully, then try again.

Ah I see what you're saying... Thanks for the suggestion!

 

[jetjock]

Glad to hear. Odd a jump didn't work but it's 5 am and I'm too tired to put much thought into it. For the future keep in mind that the voltage across a battery should not fall below 10 volts during cranking. One that does is either bad or needs charging. Voltage under no or light load means squat. This particular ECU can also be fussy when it's fed less than 11 volts.

That said I still smell a mediocre connection somewhere. Call it intuition from playing with electricity since I was a wee lad. You might want to check them all. Also check the voltage across the battery at 2000 rpm with the headlights and blower on to be sure the charging system is OK. Oh and fix the code 51.

Thanks for the PM btw. A class act if I ever saw one.

 

[Burntz]

I thought with a battery, the starting voltage should be above 12.5 for a load test, and when cranking, initial drop should be not much over a volt?

 

[Saavedro88]

Glad to hear. Odd a jump didn't work but it's 5 am and I'm too tired to put much thought into it. For the future keep in mind that the voltage across a battery should not fall below 10 volts during cranking. One that does is either bad or needs charging. Voltage under no or light load means squat. This particular ECU can also be fussy when it's fed less than 11 volts.

That said I still smell a mediocre connection somewhere. Call it intuition from playing with electricity since I was a wee lad. You might want to check them all. Also check the voltage across the battery at 2000 rpm with the headlights and blower on to be sure the charging system is OK. Oh and fix the code 51.

Thanks for the PM btw. A class act if I ever saw one.

I thought so too about the jump, but the guy at advanced said it was beyond the jumping point...

My electrical experience as a wee lad: A boyscout flashlight lightbulb + one house wall outlet = One very scared and crying wee lad!
Is there a particular connection I should check? I.e., one that frequently goes bad on our cars? I replaced the terminal connectors when I replaced the battery (it turns out it was actually) 3 months ago.

Working on the 51 over the weekend... or maybe if I get some time tomorrow... Or maybe if I ever get any spare time... :nono:

Again, thanks for all the info and for everyone's help!

 

[jetjock]

Bruntz: I was talking max limits in the car. With everything up to snuff or on a load tester it would be closer to what you're saying. Never deep discharge the typical car battery. Even a couple of times below 10 volts or so will considerably shorten it's service life. I have Priority Start controllers on all my cars for this reason and to prevent being stranded.

88: Check them all by measuring drop. Put your meter on DC millivolts and measure across each circuit (meter probes on the same wire) while it's under load. For example put one meter probe on the starter terminal and the other on the positive battery post then crank the engine. Do the same with one probe on the block ground and the other on the battery negative. More than 200 millivolts should be corrected.

I hear ya about the flashlight bulb/wall socket. When I was around 10 I put 120 volts through my parent's house telephone wiring. It was not a pretty sight.

 

[Saavedro88]

Haven't been able to check the drops yet but here's something new:
Drove it out to school, about 50 minutes and it's pretty hot out, with no problem other than some pretty intense butt-sweat. Turned it off for about 3 seconds (a little bit longer but you get the picture) Found out I was parked in the wrong place, turned it back on, and my voltmeter (or whatever you call the battery gauge...) doesn't push up past 12, it's about one and a half pegs below it. My battery light comes on, and my Brake light stays on, but dims as I take off the emergency brake. Pull to the correct spot, turn it off and pull a code 42.

"Vehicle Speed Sensor Signal

Diagnosis
No "SPD" signal to ECU for 8 seconds when engine speed is between 2,500RPM and 4,500RPM (7M-GE) or 4,000RPM (7M-GTE) and coolant temp is below 80°C(176°F) and neutral start switch is off.
Trouble Area
Vehicle speed sensor circuit
Vehicle speed sensor
ECU"

I'm not sure that I understand what this is trying to tell me but I'm almost positive my Coolant isnt' below 176 degrees right now... What does this mean?

 

[CRE]

ECU's probably not getting enough power when it's starting.

 

[Saavedro88]

So it probably has to do with that bad connection I have wherever it is?

 

[CRE]

I've been fighting with a couple codes that show up on an intermittant basis, including 42. They show up most often on cooler days after I've done a lot of city driving on the previous day.... and they usually don't show back up the following day.

The only thing I've found that could be causing them is a massive drop in voltage WHILE cranking. Once the car is started the voltage returns to normal. I haven't had time to look into it further yet. I'm thinking starter or not getting enough power from the alternator for the amount of city driving I do to fully charge the battery on days when i repeatedly have to start the car.

 

[jetjock]

88:The speed sensor is located in the speedometer. The ecu and a few other electronics uses it for several functions whenever the car is traveling over 11 mph. It's a simple magnetic reed switch that can be checked with an ohmmeter.

As for the battery light what part of "also check the voltage across the battery at 2000 rpm with the headlights and blower on to be sure the charging system is OK" didn't you understand?

 

[Saavedro88]

Nothing, I just haven't had time or another person around to do it yet... Fridays and Saturdays are the only days that I don't have anything going on. Every other day, I have to be at work at 5:30 AM and then I'm at school till 10PM.

 

[Saavedro88]

One of my classes got out early yesterday so I had about twenty minutes. I took a wild guess and pulled the alternator, tested it and it was toasted. Went out into the "Back Lot" (a large field full of non-running cars) and pulled one from an 88 Corolla. Wham, Bam, Thank you ma'am for a running car that appears to no longer have charge problems.

Code 51 this weekend!!!