Code 41 & 51

[supramk388]

So I have been trying to get this resolved for some time now.

My 91 had a slight miss in it seemed to idle fine for the most part just had this miss. I found this so I gave it a shot.

http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46793

I saw my TB was not closed all the way so I did that. After that I started car and it would not idle unless I keep the pedal down some. A min after I let off the pedal the car would die. I check codes and I got 51 so I checked the harness just in case and it was fine.

So went through thread again today trying to fix this and now getting 41 and 51. I have tried adjusting the TPS but I guess I am not doing it right. I started at dead center and went from there clockwise (in small increments checking idle and codes each tiny adjustment) but still code 51. Tried to loosen the bolts to start over with no tension moved TPS till I got a defection on IDL and E2 the way TSM says. Then checked codes and now I got 41 and 51, before I only had 51.

Anyone done this a lot and maybe can explain it differently? Not sure why I can not get this so I fig. I would ask the experts. Thanks in advance. PMs welcome as well.

 

[hvyman]

have you tried hooking up a ohm meter or replacing with a known good one?

 

[supramk388]

have you tried hooking up a ohm meter or replacing with a known good one?

You know after I posted I was thinking that esp. since I was getting 41 now. I did test the current one on the car but not sure if I took enough readings (proper readings)and it did seem to be a little sticky.

I rem. I actually have an extra TPS from an 88 TB. I would have just tried to bolt that TB on today but its a little diff so I took off the TPS last night and it seemed to test better than the TPS on the 91. The TPS on the 88 TB seems to not be as sticky as well.

I will try the 88 TPS sensor in a few hrs and see if that was it.

Thanks for your help.

 

[supramk388]

Well put in the TPS from the 88 and now back at code 51. I did not adjust it I need to run to parts store for a few things and one tool. I hope to get that 51 taken care of so I can adjust timing correctly today.

 

[jdub]

Concerning the TPS:
Code 41 = VTA
Code 51 = IDL
Two separate functions of the TPS.

Read this:
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46793

(search actually works on SM )

And this:
http://www.mkiiitech.com/forum/showthread.php?t=882

 

[supramk388]

Read this:
http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46793

(search actually works on SM )

Yeah I think I posted the same thread above JW , I am just better with pics so I found this

http://mkiiisupra.net/bbs/showthread.php?t=12132&page=1&highlight=guide+cam

I will PM you why I am having some trouble. Thanks for your help.

 

[jdub]

Post it here Rick...for me, I don't do a lot of pics. Sorry.

 

[supramk388]

I sent PM I do not need to send pics for this yet. Oh and I think I am good on the CPS as well now but I will reset it once I fix 51. I am only getting 51 now.

 

[jdub]

When you check for the code 51, make sure you foot is not on the gas and the AC button is not depressed.

For cam timing this needs to happen:

- Make sure the #1 cylinder is at TDC...place a small diameter wooden dowel or chopstick in the spark plug hole. When it gets to max height turning the crank damper, you hit TDC.
- When the above happens, the damper should be pointing at "zero".
- Both cam gears should be pointing at the index marks on the back plate at the same time.
- Everything lined up above, the CPS should look like the pic I posted in the other thread.

Something that is very important to pay attention to: When you confirm the #1 cylinder is at DTC using a chopstick (max height), the damper should be pointing at zero. Don't assume the damper is good...the chopstick tells the true TDC position. It is quite possible the rubber in the damper is twisted...if it is, it will not be pointing at zero and will have to be replaced.

 

[supramk388]

When you check for the code 51, make sure your foot is not on the gas and the AC button is not depressed.

For cam timing this needs to happen:

- Make sure the #1 cylinder is at TDC...place a small diameter wooden dowel or chopstick in the spark plug hole. When it gets to max height turning the crank damper, you hit TDC.
- When the above happens, the damper should be pointing at "zero".
- Both cam gears should be pointing at the index marks on the back plate at the same time.
- Everything lined up above, the CPS should look like the pic I posted in the other thread.

Something that is very important to pay attention to: When you confirm the #1 cylinder is at DTC using a chopstick (max height), the damper should be pointing at zero. Don't assume the damper is good...the chopstick tells the true TDC position. It is quite possible the rubber in the damper is twisted...if it is, it will have to be replaced.

Yeah I did read about the gas pedal thing but somehow tuned it out. I am pressing the gas because the car dies the min I don't keep hitting it. I have no AC and did make sure of this however.

The help with TDC is explained perfect, thanks. I will go check to make sure things are at TDC.

EDIT:

Yeah, everything was at TDC, so back to 51.

 

[jdub]

You used a chopstick to check it? (that was awfully fast)

If the AC button is depressed, it will throw a code 51...doesn't matter if the AC is working or not. Foot on the gas will also always cause a code 51...the car does not have to be running to check it. Code 51 is a real time code...it is not stored by the ECU. It's almost always a TPS adjustment issue.

 

[supramk388]

You used a chopstick to check it? (that was awfully fast)

If the AC button is depressed, it will throw a code 51...doesn't matter if the AC is working or not. Foot on the gas will also always cause a code 51...the car does not have to be running to check it. Code 51 is a real time code...it is not stored by the ECU. It's almost always a TPS adjustment issue.

LOL you timing my edits? I tried to post my last comment a bit ago but did not save due to a quote misplaced or something. I just ran an edit a few mins later instead of posting again. Should it take long to take out a plug and turn motor a few times (by hand with crank bolt)?

No meaning JW why would I have button pressed if it does not work? It has not been pressed in prob 6 months or more, lol.

Did you ever put in the AEM? If you like it so far? Are you still running auto as well?

 

[jdub]

The system shows post and edit times...11 minutes was fast. But whatever.

Rick - it's easy to have that button pushed and not pay attention to it. Half the time I tell a guy to check it and guess what?
It fixes the code 51 "problem".

Sounds like you know what you're doing, so I'll leave it to ya

 

[supramk388]

The system shows post and edit times...11 minutes was fast. But whatever.

Sounds like you know what you're doing, so I'll leave it to ya

Yeah no offense on that over the years and including the last few days you have been a big help. Thanks JW

I am rid of 51 (and 41) now I got 43 and 31. I will do some looking into those codes now.

No OT I asked about AEM because when I called a buddy of mine last night on the car he was like get rid of that stock crap and put in your MicroTec. He says its easier to work with so I am going that route in a few weeks when I get PC adapter. Just wanted to know hows things went if you were using the AEM.

 

[jdub]

Suggest you go to a dyno if you go stand alone. I have not went to the AEM...other issues have taken priority (and are sucking down $$$) over Supra upgrades for a while now.

What got rid of the code 51?

Check the AFM connector and clean. Code 43 is the starter signal.

 

[supramk388]

What got rid of the code 51?

Check the AFM connector and clean. Code 43 is the starter signal.

I guess I was wrong its still there JW. I put in new TB and TPS from a working 91 hoping that would get it but car still runs like crap. Put in new AFM and re-set codes and back at 51 again :: angry ::

Going to look into it again this weekend.