SBC/LS1 with R154, anyone done it?

[Chaingun]

I've been researching alternative motors for my Mk3, I love the 7MGTE but it just doesn't have the low end torque that i love. Recently i ran across this:http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_gmax15.htm Since both the R154 and AX15 are build by Aisin-Warner, they share a bolt pattern meaning that any R154 can be fitted to a GM bellhousing/throwout bearing and bolted directly to any Gen1-Gen3 motor. I was wondering if this had ever been done before in a Supra as it would lead to Much easier sbc or LSX conversions. I for one plan to try it with a mildly built SBC before moving up to an LS1. This also means there would be no need to convert the speedometer, or make a custom tranny mount as the original mount and driveshaft could be used as well.

 

[IBoughtASupra]

Paging Ian....

 

[S.A. supra]

Search on here for it. The guy I bought my supra from had planned on doing the swap but never completed it. He had a build thread here. He did manage to bolt it up to a gm bell using that kit. However he did hack up the r154 front bearing retainer. I'll post a pic of the carnage in a bit.

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apparently the off road crowd uses the 154 also. Hit up some of those forums for more help.

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Found the link. http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?106644-LS1-Supra-Swap&highlight=ls1*

 

[hvyman]

6 speed would be a lot nicer and easier ESP if you do a lot of highway driving.

 

[IJ.]

Dellow and CRS here in Australia do kits to run the 154 behind both engines mentioned.

I built a kit to use the Toyota Auto behind the LS.

 

[Chaingun]

Thought about using a t56 but in stock form they don't hold up well under pressure, not without some modifications. plus the whole issue with the speedo and drive shaft. one of my concerns is that with the adapter plate and bell housing the motor will sit too far forward, anyone know the length of the 7mgte and the r154 together and apart? interested in how he managed to tear up the bearing retainer, the ax transmissions these are designed for are esentially the same transmissions with alonger input shafts and and different tail shafts. going to check out that build thread but i think i'd looked at it previously as i did with Ij's turbo ls1 thread

 

[IJ.]

My adaptor put the Trans on the stock mount so the DS stays stock, engine wasn't too far forward.

 

[te72]

There was also a guy on here by the name of Syst that did an LS6 into his Mk3, was a nice build while it lasted. I believe he may have used the T56 though. Good driving transmission, it's a shame they don't hold up all that well...

 

[limequat]

Hmm. I used the advanced adapter bellhousing to make a Chevy 4.3 V6 (350 minus 2 cylinders) 2 a R151.
By definition, the crank flange needs to sit in the same spot, regardless of engine, otherwise the input shaft won't engage the pilot bearing.

 

[Chaingun]

So it seems that though sbc's and LS swaps have been done, there has never been a "bolt in" solution. I am currently wondering if the mounts that have already been designed will work, or if i'll have to fabricate my own. I know once i have mounts for the SBC, i'll just need the bolt on mount adapters to go on the sides of the ls1. I was concerned about the length of the transmission affecting fitment of the motor into the engine bay but a bit of logic suggests that if the input shaft remains the same, then the overall length of the transmission is going to remain almost identical I don't have a measuring tape on me at the moment, but as the bare block on the 7m is around 23 inches long, i'm estimating with front accessories it's about 30 inches (inclucing the fan). Does anyone have the actual length (and width/ height) with the engine assembled?

te72, i'd love to get the LS6 as it's rated much better out of the box, but i think that for my goals an LS1 with cams and heads will be sufficient. My modified 350 is estimated at about 315hp (hasn't been run since the new intake and cam were put in) with a top end of about 5500 RPM.

By my estimation the combination of that motor at 5500rpm, with my 245/45/18's and a .753 final drive gear would top out at around 148mph with alot of balls along the way. That is of course if the chart i found is correct and my 87 Turbo has a 3.91 rear end (not sure as it was an auto-tragic to manual swap done before i bought it and i can't seem to find any consistent information about rear end ratios...) Any and all thoughts are welcome i want to gather as much of the correct information as i possibly can so i can set this project in motion and have a bolt in SBC Supra by Spring.


This also means i'll have a good 7MGTE for sale soon if anyone is interested.

 

[IBoughtASupra]

Look at the VIN plate on the driver's door. It would tell you if the car had an automatic, an A340, or a manual, an R154.

 

[Chaingun]

i know that it was originally an a340, as i still have the buttons located down by the shifter for the transmission modes, as well as the vin code and the instrument cluster with the two extra lights on the Tach, what i don't know is which rear end gears i have, or which ones i should go with in the end, the 350 is limited to around 5500 rpm to avoid spinning a bearing, while the ls1 will run up to 6500 top end when finished. the 3.91 seems to be the best all around rear end for speed vs traction and economy, as it's in the middle end of the spectrum available in our cars.

 

[bioskyline]

as yours is a 88 and under, if was a factory turbo car, it will have 3.91 regardless of auto or 5 spd.

 

[IJ.]

Used to run my 350's to 7K back in the day... never spun a bearing.

 

[Chaingun]

I'll take that into consideration IJ, probably gonna put new bearings in it before it goes in the car anyways, gotta source a pan that will fit to go on the motor anyways, any recommendations? not sure of the difference in dimensions between the truck pan it has now, and and f body pan. I'm thinking an fbody is gonna be the way to go as long as it fits around the stearing rack also ty bio, i found so many conflicting sources i wasn't sure what was right.

 

[IJ.]

Most of the muscle car era pans should work but you need to do something about the rear chassis brace that's under the 7M pan, it serves an imortant function.

 

[Chaingun]

Not sure what you mean and i'm too tired to get under the car and look atm, i know theres the front subframe where the steering rack is mounted, is the chassis brace infront of or behind that? a pic may help if you have one as a google search didn't turn much up. When you built your turbo ls1 what did you do with it IJ?

 

[IJ.]

Behind the axle centreline there's a tube brace between the Lower control arms just under the pan in front of the bellhousing.

 

[Kai]

Ugh. Why not just get a 1UZ-FE, the bellhousing for it, and have an easier time wiring it all in? Oh, and it'll all be toyota instead of soiling the shell with non-toyotaness :/

 

[IJ.]

Ugh. Why not just get a 1UZ-FE, the bellhousing for it, and have an easier time wiring it all in? Oh, and it'll all be toyota instead of soiling the shell with non-toyotaness :/

Just not worth the time and effort for 1000cc more...