7MGE Vs 7MGTE REMATCH w/ Video

[Dirgle]

But now your getting into driver differences. From a stand point of machine vs machine. The N/A does have more torque RPM for RPM than the GTE off boost. If your a good driver and don't care much for you're clutch then yes you can negate the advantage.

 

[GrimJack]

mmkay, when not using a 2-step, anti-lag, or brake boosting. I was mainly citing the turbo's lag and the N/A's more aggressive gearing.

Lag? What's that? I get positive boost pressure going uphill at idle... and that's a 67mm single on a 2J.

 

[Rob_Supra87]

All this turbo talk makes me want to put mine under the knife haha, then we can have a real run at it Bryan haha

 

[Poodles]

But now your getting into driver differences. From a stand point of machine vs machine. The N/A does have more torque RPM for RPM than the GTE off boost. If your a good driver and don't care much for you're clutch then yes you can negate the advantage.

Might want to go look at dyno charts as if it's over 3K it's boosting and making more torque/HP than the N/A. Only advantage the N/A have is response which usually is the "jump" you'll see from a roll (near non-existant with a BPU 7M in the right gear).

 

[Dirgle]

Might want to go look at dyno charts as if it's over 3K it's boosting and making more torque/HP than the N/A. Only advantage the N/A have is response which usually is the "jump" you'll see from a roll (near non-existant with a BPU 7M in the right gear).

Ok so find me a good Dyno chart of a 7M in first gear. I haven't seen one and I'd be surprised if you have.

Put a good load on these motors like that of a 4th gear pull on a dyno and they will spin a turbo up real fast. But first gear, not so much. Even my 2JZ with the factory sequential system has a hard time getting even 10psi in first gear. but in fourth or fifth I go positive pressure by ~800RPM. However this debate has reached a point where we have stated or points pretty effectively, any further discussion will just be us going back and forth pointing out the exact same thing we did in the previous 5 posts. I understand where your coming from, and in your exact situation you're right. But from an engine to engine point of view I still believe I'm right. And given the Opportunity an N/A can get the Jump on a turbo. Will the N/A win in the end, No. Is the turbo motor a better concept for a performance engine, Yes I believe so. I love my turbo. Do I think lag is an issue. I drive a BPU 2JZ, lag is a myth to me. but there are certain physical properties of a turbo system you just can't change. I've stated my peace as best I can and I'll stop harping on this issue and let the thread get back on topic.

 

[Nghty89]

Your forgetting one thing. The N/A has a higher compression ratio. So unless you're into boost off the line(with brake boosting or two step) the N/A will produce more torque RPM for RPM until the GTE starts seeing positive manifold pressures.

I do have higher compression... ; P

 

[NickSupra]

I remember the day I bought my first turbo supra(auto91). I was driving it and my dad was in my 88 n/a (manual) with I/H/E. We punched them from probably a 40ish roll and the n/a slightly pulled from the turbo. Both motors were healthy also.

 

[shaeff]

I remember the day I bought my first turbo supra(auto91). I was driving it and my dad was in my 88 n/a (manual) with I/H/E. We punched them from probably a 40ish roll and the n/a slightly pulled from the turbo. Both motors were healthy also.

So you're telling me that a 210bhp (with those mods), 188rwtq (approximate) beat a 230/254 car? I/H/E on an GE gets you barely anything. I= most likely sucking in hot engine bay heat. H= producing MORE engine bay heat, E= flows a bit better. Those mods alone are not enough for an N/A to take a stock GTE.

News for you dude, that turbo car was not healthy.

Edit: I just got to watch the video now. There is no way in hell an N/A would get that much of a jump, and for that long on me. Methinks the dude in the turbo needs to improve his launching and shifting skills. Even when I was damn near bone stock, I'd dust N/As by the end of first gear at the latest.

 

[NickSupra]

News for you dude, I was there and you were not. Both cars were healthy, I did a compression test before I bought the car. We had a bone stock down to the paper toyota filter, 120k mile, mint, automatic 91 supra boosting a whopping 5ish pounds. vs an 88 , recently rebuilt engine (know it was healthy) , IHE, lighter, 5 speed n/a supra.
I actually hade a custom sealed intake box with the sogi dryer ducting (ghetto I know) mod. I actually built a heat shield for my header after it melted my first distributor cap. And my exhaust diameter was way too large for the motor, thus creating a little more hp up top (so minor) haha. The cars were pretty much neck and neck but the n/a was INCHing away.

 

[Rob_Supra87]

^i would like to hear more of this intake box lol

 

[CyFi6]

Lag? What's that? I get positive boost pressure going uphill at idle... and that's a 67mm single on a 2J.

So you have positive pressure in the manifold at closed throttle?

 

[shaeff]

News for you dude, I was there and you were not. Both cars were healthy, I did a compression test before I bought the car. We had a bone stock down to the paper toyota filter, 120k mile, mint, automatic 91 supra boosting a whopping 5ish pounds. vs an 88 , recently rebuilt engine (know it was healthy) , IHE, lighter, 5 speed n/a supra.
I actually hade a custom sealed intake box with the sogi dryer ducting (ghetto I know) mod. I actually built a heat shield for my header after it melted my first distributor cap. And my exhaust diameter was way too large for the motor, thus creating a little more hp up top (so minor) haha. The cars were pretty much neck and neck but the n/a was INCHing away.

That's all well and fine, but there's no way the N/A miraculously gained +30bhp and +65ft. lbs. tq from I/H/E to be able to walk even a stock MKIII Turbo, much less a turbo automatic that takes all the guesswork out of shifting. (unless the tranny was crap, of course)

Did you have weight reduction done to the N/A? I commend you on making the effort to drop engine bay heat. So many people look past that, it always amazes me! Though, the stock intake box likely would have served the same purpose on an N/A.

And with that oversized exhaust, you're losing torque down low. I'm just trying to wrap my head around this- it makes no sense. Did you increase the compression ratio of the N/A? I didn't mean to make it sound like I was calling you out. LOL.

 

[Igknyte]

Edit: I just got to watch the video now. There is no way in hell an N/A would get that much of a jump, and for that long on me. Methinks the dude in the turbo needs to improve his launching and shifting skills. Even when I was damn near bone stock, I'd dust N/As by the end of first gear at the latest.

refer to post number 16
i let off because i wasnt sure if we were gonna take off like that. haha. and if u notice, when it backfired my car dropped back a little bit more. didnt take me long to catch tho.

 

[Rob_Supra87]

k....I think we should do gripfest Bryan....make a official NA vs Turbo Vid haha....till I seretly turbo the car when you dont know and at the track your like WTF haha

 

[shaeff]

refer to post number 16
i let off because i wasnt sure if we were gonna take off like that. haha. and if u notice, when it backfired my car dropped back a little bit more. didnt take me long to catch tho.

I missed that. Reading>me. LOL. That explains quite a bit.

k....I think we should do gripfest Bryan....make a official NA vs Turbo Vid haha....till I seretly turbo the car when you dont know and at the track your like WTF haha

Do it!

 

[Igknyte]

k....I think we should do gripfest Bryan....make a official NA vs Turbo Vid haha....till I seretly turbo the car when you dont know and at the track your like WTF haha

LOL. then ill secretly change mine to a 1j swap lol
plus if u did then it wouldnt be NA vs Turbo anymore. lol

LOL@Shaeff. its ok reading >=me most of the time haha

 

[NickSupra]

That's all well and fine, but there's no way the N/A miraculously gained +30bhp and +65ft. lbs. tq from I/H/E to be able to walk even a stock MKIII Turbo, much less a turbo automatic that takes all the guesswork out of shifting. (unless the tranny was crap, of course)

Did you have weight reduction done to the N/A? I commend you on making the effort to drop engine bay heat. So many people look past that, it always amazes me! Though, the stock intake box likely would have served the same purpose on an N/A.

And with that oversized exhaust, you're losing torque down low. I'm just trying to wrap my head around this- it makes no sense. Did you increase the compression ratio of the N/A? I didn't mean to make it sound like I was calling you out. LOL.

Shaeff, No offense taken man, I didnt mean to come off as being so defensive either. The race was from a roll. Its been a few years, but it was from at least a 40 kick. I remember it was neck and neck with my n/a barely inching until we let off. We did not take it to very high speeds, but Im sure the turbo wouldve passed it eventually. No real weight reduction. Most of it was probably due to the auto downshifting and not being in the peak part of the powerband. Who knows for sure, it was years ago, and my mind doesnt remember all the details. Haha

 

[ricerkid]

Isn't there more to this race than just hp? The NA has a 4.30 final drive while the turbo has a 3.85ish final drive. Maybe that's why the NA pulled so hard off the line. Guys at my local track pick up a lot time with a shorter final drive and they get good 60's.

 

[Rob_Supra87]

Regret to inform everyone there won't be a rematch Bryans supra got rod knock and now he owns a V6 Charger