1jz pulling/retarding timing like crazy!!

[boostedsupra87]

hello forum i have quite the problem and im stumped ive tried everything to my knowledge , i come to seek help as i skim these forums and theres alot of knowledge here, ok so here the problem , i got a 1jz in a s13 240 single turbo, car runs great but when i get on wot u feel the ecu pulling timing like crazy! u hear the turbo spooling 15psi but the car goes nowhere i know its pulling timing, now thats with the cam sensors connected, if i disconnect the cam sensors while the engine is running it pulls like a train! im assuming the ecu is running on base timing at this point wich is y i feel it pulling hard, as soon as i connect the cam sensors bam pulls timing has no power under wot, any help is appreciated below are my mods and things ive done to troubleshoot/diagnose to the best of my ability.

mods: 1jz jza70 ecu,440s,320lph,safc,brand new harness from wiring specialties

ok heres what ive done

•checked resistance of both cam and crank sensor hot/cold spec out fine

•checked resistance of both cam and crank sensors at the jza70 ecu plugs, got same exact reading as on the cam/crank plugs so theres perfect continuity from ecu to sensors

• swapped both cam sensors for known working ones from my 1j supra

•swapped ecu with known working jza70 ecu rebuilt by DM from my supra

• swapped out 3 ignitors

• disconnected the safc and ran on stock computer as I know safc pulls/advances timing when u +/- fuel , in any case it should be advancing as im pulling fuel not adding but checked anyway

that sums up the things ive done , to my knowledge there isnt any other sensors that deal with timing that would cause it to retard timing to that extent, please any advice on where to head next is appreciated, thanks in advance

 

[boostedsupra87]

no one at all?

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[BoostPsiKPA]

Checked timing?

 

[boostedsupra87]

Checked timing?

mechanical timing yes on point cams n crank line up perfect

 

[RacerXJ220]

EDIT: just re-read how you disconnected a cam sensor.

Coolant temp sensor?

This is a tough one.

 

[boostedsupra87]

EDIT: just re-read how you disconnected a cam sensor.

Coolant temp sensor?

This is a tough one.

thank brother for the reply, im stumped and yes i checked the coolant temp sensor im going crazy

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[RacerXJ220]

The crank and cam sensors share a common ground, I think.

Double check the wiring from the ECU, to the wire at all three sensor connections (+ and - for all three, with a continuity tester). Ensure it is 100% accurate from ECU to the wire that goes into the sensor. It is possible a wire or two was switched, as I think each sensor is continuity dependent.

It is possible one sensor or two could be wired backwards.

These things can happen with aftermarket wiring harnesses, and I highly recommend you take about an hour and verify ALL of the connections and grounds with a diagram and continuity tester. It's a pain, but once you go through it correctly, it rules out the harness.

 

[boostedsupra87]

hmm i understand although i highly doubt it these wiring specialty guys have a good rep wiring is all new mil spec wiring, one question would what i did rule out the harness for example i read the resistance on the cam sensor on the ACTUAL sensor came up 1132 for the front sensor then i traced that sensors wiring all the way up to the ecu plug where cam sensor 1 goes and got the exact same 1132 so i did that for all 3 sensors and each went to thier correct place in the ecu plugs aswell as read the same resistance at the ecu plug as in the sensors ...

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[RacerXJ220]

Understood. Just trying to help.

 

[RacerXJ220]

Only other idea I have, is the timing gear on the timing pulley slipped.

Mine was loose when I removed it. I'm going to see about getting it welded.

 

[boostedsupra87]

yea no its definitely not that it would be jumping teeth and its not its definetly ignition timing being pulled

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[boostedsupra87]

Understood. Just trying to help.

yes thanks i appreciate it, i just don't know what else to do

 

[RacerXJ220]

http://www.supraforums.com/forum/sh...ike-SHIT-all-I-did-was-change-the-oil-pump..&

Sounds similar, but if his timing gear slipped backwards, and yours slipped forward or is not straight square... If you have checked everything else...

 

[boostedsupra87]

http://www.supraforums.com/forum/sh...ike-SHIT-all-I-did-was-change-the-oil-pump..&

Sounds similar, but if his timing gear slipped backwards, and yours slipped forward or is not straight square... If you have checked everything else...

good thread , after reading that a crank sensor can ohm out fine but still be bad i went ahead and pulled my known working one out of the supra which is the only sensor i haven't changed(only changed both cams sensors) upon closer inspection now under daylight i see that the ground (black wire) that goes to the bolt on the crank sensor i think its frayed i went to pull it and i touched the alternators post and sparks flew everywhere i was unaware of this frey, its not supposed to be there right ? here's a pic of the one on the car and the one i will be replacing with

 

[RacerXJ220]

Is the frayed part the shielded section?

I'm all out of ideas

 

[boostedsupra87]

Is the frayed part the shielded section?

I'm all out of ideas

yes part of the shielding, and believe me im exhausted all out of ideas

by any chance do u know exactly how the cams sensors and crank work in correlation to adjust timing ? and what exactly is happening when i run it with both sensors off that it pulls strong throughout the rpm range, my guess is the ecu uses a base set timing throughout the whole rpm with no ramp whatsoever as a safety when it cant read the cam sensors

 

[f00g00]

Codes?

 

[RacerXJ220]

That's why I mentioned the timing gear ring.

 

[boostedsupra87]

That's why I mentioned the timing gear ring.

is it possible to check the crank trigger through the hole where the crank sensor goes? maybe wiggle with a small screwdriver ? or does the crank pulley need to come off ?

 

[Letsride]

You can check it through the cps hole.