Using the Aristo tranny in the MA70

whitemike

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Aug 30, 2009
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Winter Park, Florida, United States
So,
I'm doing a 2JZ-GTE swap. I plan on using the auto that comes with the motor, maybe down the line go R154. My car is originally automatic, so I have all the stock auto stuff. Shifter, linkage, etc.

My question is..
In order to use the Aristo tranny in my MA70 chassis, what has to be done? I've done searching and I've found some individual responses and experiences but I'd like it all in one thread, possibly sticky this at some point if we get some good answers.

Mechanical:
-What driveshaft can I use? Or does it have to be custom?
-Can the stock 7M auto linkage be used, or some combination from the MK4 or SC?
-Can the stock 7M auto trans mount be used, if not, which can? Custom only?
-Will the Aristo tranny dipstick end up in a decent location, or will a custom be needed?
-How can I retain my stock speedometer?

Electrical:
-If the 2JZ-GTE swap is Auto, with Auto harness and computer, is any additional trans controller required? Or can it just all plug up and work?
-ABS, I've read different responses, is there a sensor in the tranny?


Thanks for any and all help guys. Perhaps we can put together a nice little source of info for those who want to go 2JZ auto.


Mike
 

IJ.

Grumpy Old Man
Mar 30, 2005
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If it's the Aristo Trans with Electronic Line pressure you'll need a Controller of some sort to run that and the Accumulators.
(I ran an Aristo valve body in my 340)

Not 100% sure on the rest but the Mounts and Linkage should bolt up.
 

Satan

Supramania Contributor
Mar 31, 2005
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I had a custom driveshaft made and tried using an MKIV/SC300 shifter...PITA. Have a leftover $400 driveshaft for the Aristo tranny, but doubt I'll ever use it ('cept the NEW center bearing).

Ended up going 5-speed for now, but am assuming that I can use a 1JZ/JZA70 auto trans, when I get too old and can't use the clutch (arthritis ;-). Still need the kickdown switch from under the gas pedal. Should have the right bellhousing and should mount up to the MKIII chassis fairly straightforward. Also, I am assumingthat I can still use the 2JZ ECU to control it.
 

Moss

New Member
Nov 14, 2009
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when i swapped my 2jzge+auto trans from, i believe, a '93 supra in,
i just cut the orginal trans mount up a little bit, enlarge the main hole and new holes for the different bolt pattern.
also i used my original driveshaft.

new bolt pattern
11092010003.jpg


enlarged main hole (only the sides needed widening)
11092010002.jpg



11092010001o.jpg



however i still have no idea what i'm going to do about the speedo
 

Satan

Supramania Contributor
Mar 31, 2005
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For the speedo, I got an Apexi Rev/Speed Meter deal. Again, did not install. Still I think, using the MKIII shifter and JZA70 tranny/bellhousing is probably the easiest route to go. Seems like most 1JZers went w/the R154, so there are still quite a few of those auto trannies sitting around.

---------- Post added at 11:41 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:39 AM ----------

Hmmm... I think that when I was researching all of the connections for the swap, the Aristo/MKIV diagrams showed a kickdown switch. I even looked to get the switch from SC300/SC400s. Been awhile tho, so I may be wrong.
 

whitemike

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Aug 30, 2009
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Ok.

I've done some more research. It seems that the 1JZ tranny uses a cable for line pressure. Also seems that the tail shaft output is the same as the 7M's auto tranny so perhaps the stock auto driveshaft would bolt up.

Can anyone verify this info? If I'm correct, I'd just need to figure out what TC to use. Perhaps the 1JZ flexplate would bolt up to the 2JZ and I could use 1JZ everything from there back.

Also, since the 1JZ was offered in the A70 chassis, maybe the trans mount and everything else would be a bolt-on affair as well. I'll post my findings when I do some more searching.

Mike
 

whitemike

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Here's a great post I found on ClubLexus.


INTRODUCTION



The A340E we will be discussing came mated to both the 2JZ-GTE (TT Supra and Aristo) and 2JZ-GE(SC300 and Non-Turbo Supra). It also came in the 4runner, Tacoma, and some Jeeps and Volvos. The A340 is different than the A341 which came in SC400s and LS400s, with the short explanation of the differences is that the A341 has a slightly longer 1st gear.



The bellhousings of the TT auto and N/A autos will both bolt up to the 2jz, however on a visual inspection the TT bellhousing is slightly larger to clear the larger TT torque converter.



While I am not sure how similar the A340E from the SC300 is to the A341E in the SC400 I would imagine the link below which is about swapping input shafts. Theoretically though you should be able to swap the input shafts on the two trannies which would allow you to retain your SC300 torque converter, flexplate, and flexplate bolts.



http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/archi.../t-336619.html



The tailshafts are also different with the n/a tranny having a hole for the driveshaft to slip into and the TT auto having a bolt on flange. Swapping tailshafts is much harder though as you'd need to literally disassemble the entire transmission to swap the tailshafts.



Here is a thread which should give you a general idea of what you'd need to do to swap tailshafts.



http://www.supras.nl/index.php?optio...d=35&Itemid=52



Links

http://www.max-boost.co.uk/max-boost..._DIAGNOSIS.PDF



http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/AT08.pdf







DIFFERENCES




TT Auto



- HP Limit -425-450 w/ a good cooler.

- Valve body has 4 solenoids, the 4th solenoid controls line pressure electronically. This allows smoother shift modulation.

- Has a larger torque converter that is more efficient.

- TT torque converter requires use of a TT flexplate and TT flexplate bolts.

- Driveshaft bolts onto the transmission to a 3 bolt flange.

- Has a different input shaft than the n/a tranny.

- Has more clutch packs than the n/a auto.

- Valve body solenoids activate linearly allowing more precise transmission control.





N/A Auto




- HP Limit : ~325-350 w/ a good cooler

- Transmission line pressure is controlled by a cable and only has 3 solenoids in the valve body.

- Has a slip type tailshaft housing for the driveshaft. Driveshaft slips into the transmission itself.

- Valve body solenoids have an on and off activation.



The biggest problem with the n/a auto's in our cars is the fact that it has an extremely low HP limit.



You can shim the accumulators in the N/A auto which allows for quicker shifts, reducing the amount of time the clutch packs slip and therefore creates less heat allowing for more hp. But the problem with n/a A340's compared to the TT auto is there is a limit to shimming in the fact that it simply doesn't have enough clutch packs to hold much power.



So far, people with n/a auto's don't have many options when it comes to stronger tranny's. BL and many other companies offer rebuilds that allow for a higher hp limit but these services generally cost around 2 grand and can't hold much more than the stock TT auto, which isnt' very much more considering how much it costs. In these services the most notable change is they swap out the clutch packs with raybestos blue plate clutch packs which are stronger.



When you shim the accumulators however, you should may want to consider shimming the 1-2 shift a little less agressively because the next weakness in the tranny after clutch packs is the 2nd gear sprague and hard 1-2 shifts can break it.



The reason swapping a TT auto is complicated is because of the line pressure issue with the valve bodies. Believe it or not, the cable the n/a auto has is NOT a kickdown cable but a cable to control line pressure. The problem with the TT tranny is line pressure is controlled electronically via a solenoid. The solenoid is linearly controlled and allows for more precise line pressure control. So far, the only way to control the TT tranny is with an AEM, however.



A 1500 dollar solution to simple transmission control.
frown.gif
Latent Solutions makes the 'suprastick' tranny controller but it will only work with the n/a valve body, ie: valve bodies with mechanical line pressure.



Pictures

The TT tranny is the bottom tranny and the n/a tranny is the top tranny. Here you can see the differences in the tailshafts and that the two trannies are almost identical internally.

med_gallery_6207_226_187587.jpg




Closeup of an n/a tranny.

med_gallery_6207_226_1590440.jpg




Closeup of a TT tranny.

med_gallery_6207_226_1583330.jpg




The TT valve body is on the bottom and the N/A valve body is on top. You can tell the TT valve body is much larger and doesnt have the two tubes going into the back part of the tranny. One of these tubes sends fluid to the B3 accumulator while the other one sends fluid to lubricate the tailshaft.

med_gallery_6207_226_381886.jpg




This is a picture of an n/a tranny's clutchpacks.

med_gallery_6207_226_854205.jpg




Here you can see that the TT tranny has more clutchpacks.

med_gallery_6207_226_373683.jpg




All the n/a hardware (valve body, mechanical line pressure cable, and solenoids) bolt right into the TT tranny.

med_gallery_6207_226_70995.jpg


med_gallery_6207_226_507128.jpg




You'll need to swap the wiring harness for the valve body though.

med_gallery_6207_226_1324713.jpg




Wiring harness comes out easy, just swap the n/a for the TT one.

med_gallery_6207_226_826008.jpg




The TT tranny has a simple plug where the cable for line pressure goes into the n/a tranny. Simply pull out the plug and swap the cable into the TT tranny.

med_gallery_6207_226_708433.jpg




You also need to swap the gear selectors.

med_gallery_6207_226_1305612.jpg




The accumulator on the far right bottom by itself away from the other cluster of 3 accumulators needs to be swapped with the n/a one and springs. When swapping in the n/a valve body you dont need the cap that comes with the TT one.

med_gallery_6207_226_1088684.jpg




I plan on however, swapping the valve body from a non-turbo A340 into a TT A340 so I can have the extra clutch packs AND the mechanical line pressure control, so I don't have to go AEM.



More to come!


---------- Post added at 12:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:56 AM ----------

So, the answer seems to be..

Grab a N/A A340 tranny, swap the valvebody into the Aristo tranny along with the cable. I'll see about swapping the tailshafts as well.

I'm still going to look into the 1JZ tranny thing.

Mike
 

Moss

New Member
Nov 14, 2009
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Sydney
the shaft i used was from my mk3.

the 7mge auto tans and the 2jzge auto trans are very similar on the outside, just the 2j trans has more electronics
 

IBoughtASupra

New Member
Mar 10, 2009
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Queens, NY
Mike, I would believe that the 1JZ auto tranny would work. It came in our car and I believe it would use the same crossmember as well, I don't see why Toyota would change it, and if they did, it is not hard to make a crossmember for a transmission.

The R154 and 1JZ flywheel is what we use to bolt up a 2JZ in our cars, so the crank did not change from Auto to manual 1JZ and 2JZ which means the crank is the same. If the crank bolting pattern is the same to have the 1JZ flywheel bolt up to the 2JZ crank, the flex plate bolts in the same pattern as 1JZ flywheel does on the crank, which means if my logic is correct it should bolt up to the 2JZ as well.

Basically, both 1JZ flywheel and flex plate use the same bolting patterns to mate on the crank. The 1JZ and 2JZ have the same bolt patterns on the crank which means the 1JZ flex plate should bolt up to the crank and allow the 1JZ torque converter and transmission to be used.

Problem with this setup would be can the 2JZ auto ECU run the 1JZ transmission or did I miss something you posted saying it can?