Tein vs Eibach springs ?

[rodama5anthony]

so im running stance coilovers and the front is alittle to soft so i wanna go up to 16k in the front and leave the 10k in the rear. after looking at my options of springs i cant decide between Tein or Eibach. so im looking for peoples input and experiences =]

 

[rodama5anthony]

come on? no one has any input of tein or eibach springs?

 

[RockPaperSwoRD]

you have stance coilovers and you want to downgrade to an entry level spring?
are you running stock sways?

 

[rodama5anthony]

you have stance coilovers and you want to downgrade to an entry level spring?
are you running stock sways?

? alright well let me ask you this, the front at the moment is 14k and over steer is still present even when i stiffen the front completely and soften the back completely, wouldnt replacing the 14k springs with 16k reduce the amount of oversteer? and what would you do if you wanted to eliminate oversteer? ( and yes at the moment i am on stock sways)

 

[LordDigital]

? alright well let me ask you this, the front at the moment is 14k and over steer is still present even when i stiffen the front completely and soften the back completely, wouldnt replacing the 14k springs with 16k reduce the amount of oversteer? and what would you do if you wanted to eliminate oversteer? ( and yes at the moment i am on stock sways)

Your OverSteer has very little to do with your springs if you are already running 14k. It is more than likely caused by low static camber first and then sways , tires ,bushings ,etc. Post your current setup and geometry settings if you need any more info.

 

[rodama5anthony]

Your OverSteer has very little to do with your springs if you are already running 14k. It is more than likely caused by low static camber first and then sways , tires ,bushings ,etc. Post your current setup and geometry settings if you need any more info.

thanks for the info. 14k in front and 10k in rear. the front is lowered as much as i can possible go with out rubbing the liner on bumps. the rear is lowered but not as much so that i dont get to much negative camber probably just a degree or two ( planning on getting Beech adjustable control arms) front tires are new but rears still have a good amount of tread. running on stock sways and bushings are not new from what i can tell. but even with everything else i shouldnt be getting crazy oversteer or having to worry about my tail sliding out when im running full stiff in front and full soft in back!

 

[LordDigital]

thanks for the info. 14k in front and 10k in rear. the front is lowered as much as i can possible go with out rubbing the liner on bumps. the rear is lowered but not as much so that i dont get to much negative camber probably just a degree or two ( planning on getting Beech adjustable control arms) front tires are new but rears still have a good amount of tread. running on stock sways and bushings are not new from what i can tell. but even with everything else i shouldnt be getting crazy oversteer or having to worry about my tail sliding out when im running full stiff in front and full soft in back!

You have to start by changing your front sway ,because it is probably the easiest. The bushings would be next thing on the list. These will both REDUCE your underSteer but they can't eliminate it.Eliminating the underSteer on street or semi-slick tires is a major challenge - from my experience with MA70 you need (-2.5 to -3.0) of negative camber in the front to get the car to steer almost naturally (very very little underSteer ) ,and then from -3.0 to -4.x to completely eliminate the underSteer. These numbers are for setups with at least 8degrees of caster ,good sway bars and excelent dampers (BuddyClub ,Tein Ra ,etc) . I ran as much as -4.3 on the front left wheel at Gingerman race track... To do all that you would need custom LCA or UCA ,it is unfortunate that noOne makes these ,Wes products are rear suspension arms only...

Alternetvley you could also try with tires with build in negative camber ,such as RA050. I don't have experience with these on MA70 but they should be pretty good.

 

[rodama5anthony]

You have to start by changing your front sway ,because it is probably the easiest. The bushings would be next thing on the list. These will both REDUCE your underSteer but they can't eliminate it.Eliminating the underSteer on street or semi-slick tires is a major challenge - from my experience with MA70 you need (-2.5 to -3.0) of negative camber in the front to get the car to steer almost naturally (very very little underSteer ) ,and then from -3.0 to -4.x to completely eliminate the underSteer. These numbers are for setups with at least 8degrees of caster ,good sway bars and excelent dampers (BuddyClub ,Tein Ra ,etc) . I ran as much as -4.3 on the front left wheel at Gingerman race track... To do all that you would need custom LCA or UCA ,it is unfortunate that noOne makes these ,Wes products are rear suspension arms only...

Alternetvley you could also try with tires with build in negative camber ,such as RA050. I don't have experience with these on MA70 but they should be pretty good.

thank you very much i appreciate it alot. i think i will start by getting the whiteline front sway bars and go on from there

 

[supraguru05]

I would recommend on learning how to drive the car as it sits. If a car is prone to understeer or oversteer there are many techniques and things you can change before you go spending a bunch of money trying to cover up what could be a driver issues. The most important thing is seat time, get more of it and your car might start handling better. All that being said you do at least need a set of upgraded sway bars, because without them the body roll will be high enough to really lean the tires over.

 

[IJ.]

you have stance coilovers and you want to downgrade to an entry level spring?
are you running stock sways?

Eibach make more than just entry level gear......

 

[rodama5anthony]

I would recommend on learning how to drive the car as it sits. If a car is prone to understeer or oversteer there are many techniques and things you can change before you go spending a bunch of money trying to cover up what could be a driver issues. The most important thing is seat time, get more of it and your car might start handling better. All that being said you do at least need a set of upgraded sway bars, because without them the body roll will be high enough to really lean the tires over.

im may not be pro but i can definitely drive and i can tell when the rear is itching to slide out. and i only thought of changing the front springs since they will be a lot cheaper then a swaybar a.nd will minimize this oversteer im feeling

---------- Post added at 04:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:06 PM ----------

while i got your attention if i were to change the front springs from 14k to 16k which company would be more reliable and give the better results eibach, tein, or any other?

 

[supraguru05]

Are you replacing your stance coilovers? if you are just replacing the springs on your stance setup I bet stance has replacement springs and I would start there.

 

[rodama5anthony]

Are you replacing your stance coilovers? if you are just replacing the springs on your stance setup I bet stance has replacement springs and I would start there.

yes i was just planning on replacing the springs. thanks for letting me now ill contact stance and see how much that will cost before i go throwing my money around

 

[destrux]

? alright well let me ask you this, the front at the moment is 14k and over steer is still present even when i stiffen the front completely and soften the back completely, wouldnt replacing the 14k springs with 16k reduce the amount of oversteer? and what would you do if you wanted to eliminate oversteer? ( and yes at the moment i am on stock sways)

By stiffen I assume you're talking about the rebound damping knob, since you can't stiffen the springs without changing them. Adjusting the rebound damping stiffer in the front isn't going to reduce oversteer. Adjusting compression damping would, but it would only affect the initial response, and the car would go back to oversteering after the car settles into the turn. I don't know if the stance coilover have adjustable rebound or compression or both combined on one knob (usually in that price range it's just rebound). The spring rates you're running are already good for street tires, I'd experiment with a stiffer front sway and leave the springs alone for now. If you do change springs, I'd go with softer rear springs first, 8K maybe. If the front sway and 8K rears still don't do it, then I'd try the 16K front, but I don't think you'll have to.

 

[rodama5anthony]

By stiffen I assume you're talking about the rebound damping knob, since you can't stiffen the springs without changing them. Adjusting the rebound damping stiffer in the front isn't going to reduce oversteer. Adjusting compression damping would, but it would only affect the initial response, and the car would go back to oversteering after the car settles into the turn. I don't know if the stance coilover have adjustable rebound or compression or both combined on one knob (usually in that price range it's just rebound). The spring rates you're running are already good for street tires, I'd experiment with a stiffer front sway and leave the springs alone for now. If you do change springs, I'd go with softer rear springs first, 8K maybe. If the front sway and 8K rears still don't do it, then I'd try the 16K front, but I don't think you'll have to.

thank you for the input. I have been running the whiteline front sway bar for about a month and oversteer for the most part has been eliminated. now i only feel it at high speed cornering. the rear begins to slip out slowly but this may be due to my worn out rear tires. i have new tires in the front but old ones in the back ( they are not bald still have some meat on them) any other possible causes for oversteer at higher speeds?

 

[bugz66]

what works for me at high speed corners besides the suspension, is my tires (bridgestone potenza RE050a RFT)
the run flat tires dont give out/fold as easily.other tires i have used gave out causing me to get oversteer/understeer.

 

[rodama5anthony]

what works for me at high speed corners besides the suspension, is my tires (bridgestone potenza RE050a RFT)
the run flat tires dont give out/fold as easily.other tires i have used gave out causing me to get oversteer/understeer.

thanks man ill remember that wen i go to buy new tires

 

[keshigomu]

believe it or not tires is a big part of handling, i have a 245 in rear and 225 in front, it handles like a dream on the mountans passes, without good tires the car will understeer alot more then expected even if u have good suspension.

 

[VegaSupra]

I don't have anything technical to add but I will say that the setup I used on my previous 91T was stellar. I basically copied Chris Jensen's setup, minus the additional interior bars.

Eibach Pro-Kit Springs
Tokico TEMS shocks
Suspension Techniques Anti-Sway bars (Front & Rear)
17x8 Focal Rims with 235 front and 245 rear Nitto NT555 tires.

My Supra handled like it was on rails. If fact, I've owned a 2005 RX-8 GT, which is known for having amazing handling, and I believe my Supra (even being 14 years older) handled at least as well as the super lightweight RX8 and felt more predictable and solid at higher speeds.

Since all of these items are somehow still available to purchase, I will likely copy that setup again as I have no complaints and only praise for it.

Cheers!

 

[hvyman]

Stiffer sway bars can make up for softer springs. Like a stiffer sway bar will make your 14k springs feel like 16k.(guess not factual, but the statement is a example.)

They will also help with roll.

Better tires would also be a huge factor at when the back end wants to go. IF you have some nexan n3000 on there of course its not going to handle great.