I have valve tick, is it shims or guides ?

[phoenix6]

I caught valve tick after rebuilding my engine, I used the same head however. I remember whne I was putting the valve lifters back on, one of the shims came off, I thought nothing of it, it popped back on, if it came off, would it be whats making the ticking noise that runs with RPMs or is it the valve guides? I cant figure it out yet and Im wondering whats most common and what to check and so on and so forth.

 

[Yellow 13]

Did you torque it down correctly, or did any debris stick to the shim?

 

[phoenix6]

Did you torque it down correctly, or did any debris stick to the shim?

no debris, yes torqued properly. I just dont know which part of the valve stuff is ticking.

 

[phoenix6]

stuck lifter?

 

[Aaron J Williams]

Loose valve clearance causes a tick, loose valve guide causes blue smoke out the tailpipe on startup.

 

[phoenix6]

Loose valve clearance causes a tick, loose valve guide causes blue smoke out the tailpipe on startup.

How do I check valve clearance? wouldnt a stuck lifter cause something like this? Its almost on and off kinda, like fixes for a sec then back to it, and I know the valve is still locked in the retainer bc its not bouncing around in the cyl

 

[Yellow 13]

We dont have lifters. You might have a worn/broken spring.

 

[GotToyota?]

If it isn't too loud then you don't have anything to worry about, it's quite common.

-Matt

 

[phoenix6]

If it isn't too loud then you don't have anything to worry about, it's quite common.

-Matt

uh, its kinda loud, and sounds bad and makes my idle kinda iffy sometimes. The 02 sensor is shot, but I thought that didnt affect idle. Anyways, its a loud slap or tick and was NEVER there before. I dont wanna destroy my damn valve.


Yellow, we do have lifters, http://www.cygnusx1.net/Supra/Library/TSRM/MK3/manual.aspx?Section=EM&Page=41

Step 10.

 

[phoenix6]

any more information guys?

 

[jdub]

Man - you're gonna have to pull the valve covers and take a look...make sure there's not any crap under the cams or shims. Check the shim clearances per the TRSM.

 

[phoenix6]

which page is that on?

Judging soley by past knowledge, what does this SOUND like it could be? Im thinking stuck lifter, any other possible ideas?

 

[jdub]

Don't know the page off hand.

Valve train noise is at 1/2 speed of the motor...drive train noise (rods, crank, etc) is 1:1 with rpm. Get a timing light and hook it up...shine the light at the pulley. If the noise is in sync with the light, it's the valve train....if it's twice the speed of the light, it's the rods/crank.

 

[phoenix6]

Don't know the page off hand.

Valve train noise is at 1/2 speed of the motor...drive train noise (rods, crank, etc) is 1:1 with rpm. Get a timing light and hook it up...shine the light at the pulley. If the noise is in sync with the light, it's the valve train....if it's twice the speed of the light, it's the rods/crank.

Its valves, trust me on this one hahaha, I even have a vid Brn2Drv sent me 6 months ago when his car had this problem and I had rod knock to see if it as valves. It wasnt then. It is now.

 

[RacerXJ220]

a loose/leaky exhaust manifold can cause it to sound "ticky" too, especially while revving. If the tick just started, it wouldn't hurt you to look at that.

 

[jdub]

Ok...I remember you installed a set of valves on the intake side....is the sound you're hearing coming from the intake side?

Did you:

- Inspect the lifter oil clearances?
- Check each lifter for rotation?
- Check each spring for proper free length?
- Check the camshaft oil clearances?
- Install the camshaft caps in numerical order from front to back?
- Torque the camshaft caps down in the order shown in the TRSM?
- Check valve shim clearances on both the intake and exhaust valves

 

[phoenix6]

a loose/leaky exhaust manifold can cause it to sound "ticky" too, especially while revving. If the tick just started, it wouldn't hurt you to look at that.

Its from idle to rev all the way through, its kinda on and off sometimes.

 

[Aaron J Williams]

Measure Valve Clearance

* Remove Cylinder Head Covers
* Set No.1 cylinder to TDC/compression.
* Turn the crankshaft pulley and align its groove with the "0" mark on the No.1 timing belt cover.

Valve Measurement Step 1



* Check that the valve lifters on the No.1 cylinder are loose and valve lifters on the No.6 cylinder are tight.
* If not, turn the crankshaft pulley one complete revolution.
* Measure the clearance of No.1 (IN) and No.4 (IN) and No.1 (EX) and No.5 (EX) valves.
* Record the measurements which are out of specification. They will be used later to determine the required replacement shims.

Valve clearance (Cold):
Intake 0.15 - 0.25 mm (0.006 - 0.010 in.)

Exhaust 0.20 - 0.30 mm (0.008 - 0.012 in.)

Valve Measurement Step 2



* Turn the crankshaft pulley 2/3 revolution (240°) and measure the clearance of No.3 (IN) and No.5 (IN) and No.3 (EX) and No.6 (EX) valves.
* Check that the valve lifters on the No.3 cylinder are loose.
* Record the measurements which are out of specification. They will be used later to determine the required replacement shims.

Valve Measurement Step 3



* Turn the crankshaft pulley 2/3 revolution (240°) and measure the clearance of No.2 (IN) and No.6 (IN) and No.2 (EX) and No.4 (EX) valves.
* Check that the valve lifters on the No.2 cylinder are loose.
* Record the measurements which are out of specification. They will be used later to determine the required replacement shims.

Adjust Valve Clearance
Removing Adjusting Shim



* Remove the adjusting shim.
* Turn the crankshaft so that the cam lobe for the valve to be adjusted faces up.
* Position the valve lifter notch so that the shim can be removed with a small screwdriver.
* Using SST (A), press down the valve lifter and place SST (B) between the camshaft and valve lifter. Remove SST (A).

SST 09248-55020 (09248-05011, 09248-05021)

Removing Adjusting Shim



HINT: For easy removal of the shim, when positioning SST (B), set it on the lifter so there is space enough to be able to remove the shim.

Removing Adjusting Shim



* Remove the adjusting shim with a small screwdriver and magnetic finger.
* Determine the replacement shim size by using the following Formula .

Shim Measurement



* Using a micrometer, measure the thickness of the shim which was removed.
* Calculate the thickness of the new shim so that the valve clearance comes within specified value.

T = Thickness of used shim
A = Measured valve clearance
N = Thickness of new shim

Intake N = T + (A - 0.20 mm (0.0079 in.)
ExhaustN = T + (A - 0.25 mm (0.0098 in.)


* Select a new shim with a thickness as close as possible to the calculated value.

HINT: Shims are available in 17 sizes, in increments of 0.050 mm (0.0020 in.) , from 2.500 mm (0.0984 in.) to 3.300 mm (0.1299 in.).

Installing Adjusting Shim



* Install the new adjusting shim.
* Place the new adjusting shim on the valve lifter.
* Using SST (A), press down the valve lifter and remove SST (B).

SST 09248-55020 (09248-05011, 09248-05021)

* Recheck the valve clearance.

 

[jdub]

So (since you didn't answer the questions), I assume you did not follow the TRSM guidance concerning clearances. And you actually expected it to run correctly? Come on man...if you expect this thing to run, you gotta do it right. Doing the rush, rush...get it done...taking shorcuts method of engine building is going to nail you every time on this motor :3d_frown:

 

[phoenix6]

So (since you didn't answer the questions), I assume you did not follow the TRSM guidance concerning clearances. And you actually expected it to run correctly? Come on man...if you expect this thing to run, you gotta do it right. Doing the rush, rush...get it done...taking shorcuts method of engine building is going to nail you every time on this motor :3d_frown:

Its not that I rushed, I took out the lifters and replaced the same ones back where they belong. Same exact holes. I had to go to work thats why I didnt answer, I pretty much did all that except measuring the clearances. I need a micrometer. Theres a chance I mixed 2 lifters on one cylinder, like cyl 4, the lifters could be in eachothers holes, Ill check that out in a little bit. How much are feeler gauges?

If the clearance was off, for the shims, wouldnt it have done this right away? The motor was cranked up about 20 times while I was setting timing and adjusting other shit, this tick came later from the valves.