How important are torque plates exactly

[TheNewRed]

I just want a full raw answer as to how important they are, im possibly doing a CP piston build so .040 over is called for. How badly will not using a tourqe plate affect performance? im expecting 600HP out of this next motor, tops. O and are these torque plates made specificly for the 7M, and how hard are they to come by?

[IJ.]

If you want round straight bores quite important if not not so much.... ;)

Initial ring seal will be faster/sooner if bored and honed using a plate.

SupraRich has them available on his site.

[Rennat]

you could post a WTB or "want to borrow"... i paid a guy like $40 and paid for shipping both ways and he let me borrow his.

[TheNewRed]

Thanks guys. So the reason i ask is 1. everyone on here goes nuts when they hear you didnt use one. and 2. I was reading through my "Engine Blueprinting" book and it was stating the extremes that some guys go to to replicate the stresses on the block while in use, like bolting on engine mounts, waterpump housings(V8s), and even flow hot water through the cooling jackets. They also stated that there were power gains in certain cituations, b/c of the top of the cylinder is supposedly the weakest part and more compression is lost at TDC(blowby) if a plate isnt used(maybe i read that part wrong).

I'm going to see if i can borrow one, but would the block last at 600HP without using one?

[Rennat]

if your REALLY going to be building a 600hp engine, you wont over look the small things.

Have you priced out all of the machine work? The guy charged me around $80 because i had him use a torque plate to bore and hone my cylinders. and another $40 to the guy who i borrowed the plate from.

your talking about $150 roughly... one TIRE on a 600hp build should be more than $150... its such a small fraction to really hit 600hp, you'd be stupid to not use a torque plate. especially when they are available to the public now, either through borrowing, or through buying one from suprarich.

[TheNewRed]

if your REALLY going to be building a 600hp engine, you wont over look the small things.

Have you priced out all of the machine work? The guy charged me around $80 because i had him use a torque plate to bore and hone my cylinders. and another $40 to the guy who i borrowed the plate from.

your talking about $150 roughly... one TIRE on a 600hp build should be more than $150... its such a small fraction to really hit 600hp, you'd be stupid to not use a torque plate. especially when they are available to the public now, either through borrowing, or through buying one from suprarich.
I AM building a 600 car( this thread is for engine mechanical, not lectures on tires, and if it is of your concern im running 255/60R15 E.t. streets on jegs sport stars, and M/t front runners)P.s. i never once stated im on a dirt cheap budget my friend, and please do not patronize me;)...just asking for some POSITIVE knowledge on the subject matter.

[Rennat]

i just know how i was... and how a lot of others are around here when it comes to that magic little 600hp level...

but yes you want a torque plate so that when you bolt the head on the block, it flexes the same as it did when it was bored & hones. and you want the timing belt tensioner torqued to 36ft lbs... IJ is the expert on that little thing though.

and dont worry, no question is ever too stupid... i asked so many questions while i was rebuilding my engine, and i dont regret it one bit. hope you can get one sourced though, im not sure what happened to the guy i used...

[TheNewRed]

i just know how i was... and how a lot of others are around here when it comes to that magic little 600hp level...

but yes you want a torque plate so that when you bolt the head on the block, it flexes the same as it did when it was bored & hones. and you want the timing belt tensioner torqued to 36ft lbs... IJ is the expert on that little thing though.

and dont worry, no question is ever too stupid... i asked so many questions while i was rebuilding my engine, and i dont regret it one bit. hope you can get one sourced though, im not sure what happened to the guy i used...

Its cool, im more just looking to lay down a really nice time at the track, not to just say i have 600HP.

I.J. can we hear your procedure for overboring?

So yeah i posted up in the wanted section, if anyone sees this that has one i can borrow please PM me so we can worki it out(ill pay you).

[IJ.]

TNR: Nothing fancy just make sure all of the hardware you're going to use is installed and torqued to spec including the Cam belt tensioner.

ie: Main studs and Head studs, same style HG (I keep a dead one for this), the guys doing the actual boring "should" cover the rest but if they're reluctant to follow the above steps or try to tell you it's not worth their time take the block somewhere else.

[TheNewRed]

TNR: Nothing fancy just make sure all of the hardware you're going to use is installed and torqued to spec including the Cam belt tensioner.

ie: Main studs and Head studs, same style HG (I keep a dead one for this), the guys doing the actual boring "should" cover the rest but if they're reluctant to follow the above steps or try to tell you it's not worth their time take the block somewhere else.

Thanks I.J., im still searching for one though.

[wiseco7mgt]

TNR: Nothing fancy just make sure all of the hardware you're going to use is installed and torqued to spec including the Cam belt tensioner.

ie: Main studs and Head studs, same style HG (I keep a dead one for this), the guys doing the actual boring "should" cover the rest but if they're reluctant to follow the above steps or try to tell you it's not worth their time take the block somewhere else.

Hi IJ can you explain this a little more, i spent alot on machining a year ago and had everything possible machined and balanced including the already balanced forged pistons.Are you saying the head should be torqued down along with the head gasket being used while boring? I never included it because i thought they bored from the top down not the bottom up.

[IJ.]

Torque plate = Dummy head with holes for the boring bar to pass through, it simulates the stress and deformation caused by the head being bolted in place.

[wiseco7mgt]

Torque plate = Dummy head with holes for the boring bar to pass through, it simulates the stress and deformation caused by the head being bolted in place.

doh, i miss read.Thanks for clearing that up.::dunce::

[IJ.]

doh, i miss read.Thanks for clearing that up.::dunce::

Just cos ya got a pointy hat doesn't make you sharp ;)

[wiseco7mgt]

Nope if i was smart id be in bed with my wife instead of looking at cars.lol

[IJ.]

LMAO I can't think of anything to say that wouldn't be offensive sp I'll just shut up :D

[wiseco7mgt]

lmao. the night is still young!

[IJ.]

I know where I'd rather be after seeing her pic ;)

[wiseco7mgt]

rofl.....sorry for the thread sidetrack.

[TheNewRed]

rofl.....sorry for the thread sidetrack.

LOL just for that you have to go to the center of the earth, fight jesus and win me a TORQUE PLATE!!!:biglaugh:

[wiseco7mgt]

LOL just for that you have to go to the center of the earth, fight jesus and win me a TORQUE PLATE!!!:biglaugh:

Ha hahah just buy one you cheap bastard lol..
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Torque-Plate-Toyota-Supra-7mgte-turbo-MK3-MKIII-MA70_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742Q2em153Q2el1262QQcategoryZ33623QQihZ006QQitemZ160256644163QQtcZphoto

[TheNewRed]

Ha hahah just buy one you cheap bastard lol..
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Torque-Plate-Toyota-Supra-7mgte-turbo-MK3-MKIII-MA70_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742Q2em153Q2el1262QQcategoryZ33623QQihZ006QQitemZ160256644163QQtcZphoto

SON OF A BITCH!!!! i just looked on ebay yesterday, and couldnt find any. maybe ill look into this.

[wiseco7mgt]

yeah i knew he had them, i bought some gear off him a while ago and remember seeing them on there.Just pm him he's on this forum.

[Rennat]

you should PM suprarich on here (he runs SIP racing) and see if he'll give you a better deal than the ebay ad.

[grimreaper]

what else to bolt on the block while boring? cam tensioner, torq. plate, main studs with caps?

[IJ.]

Correct Mains are a must, if you were being ultra Anal about it all the accessories and you'd run Coolant through it as well.

It's surprising just how much the big lump of cast iron can move around.

[wiseco7mgt]

^some good info here, going into my 7mgte build tips folder.Who'd have thunk such a solid ass block would be so touchy..:icon_surp

[TheNewRed]

I think im going to take my block to 927mgtepat s machinist. Pat has a plate and the machinst is supposedly pretty good.

[JDMMA70]

TNR: Nothing fancy just make sure all of the hardware you're going to use is installed and torqued to spec including the Cam belt tensioner.

ie: Main studs and Head studs, same style HG (I keep a dead one for this), the guys doing the actual boring "should" cover the rest but if they're reluctant to follow the above steps or try to tell you it's not worth their time take the block somewhere else.

Sorry if this sounds like a stupid question but i just want to 100% sure when you say same style HG you mean, using the same "type" of headgasket you will use in EX. a MHG?

Correct?

Sorry again but thanks for your time
~JDMMA70

[IJ.]

Correct!

You're trying to simulate the engines installed condition.

[Rennat]

AND i was reading in a book at work, about engine building, that you should also gap your rings with the torque plate installed... which actually makes perfect sense since then it will be the same when you torque the head down...

never thought about it on my engine though....

[JDMMA70]

^any input on this?

[TheNewRed]

AND i was reading in a book at work, about engine building, that you should also gap your rings with the torque plate installed... which actually makes perfect sense since then it will be the same when you torque the head down...


I've never heard of that, but it makes perfect sense.

[IJ.]

It's a little over the top for a street engine but if you have the torque plate bolted down at the time you're doing rings it makes sense. ;)