Cams

[corylee316]

I've done some searching off site and have not been able to come up with anything for the NA. Do you have to get custom grinds or am I just not hitting the right sites. I'm thinking future project and want to know what kind of options that I might have. Thanks in advance.

[Ma70.Ent]

As far as I know, there are no cams for the NAs, just regrinds.

[corylee316]

So are the regrinds a stock cam or are they a different grind. I know that custom cams can be made but they aren't cheap.

[Sawbladz]

re-grinds use your cams as a starting point and reduce the base circle to give the cam a different profile. Search, you will find excellent information on this site, much better than I could ever explain.

[935motorsports]

A regrind is taking your original cam and "re-grinding it" to your specifications.

This makes the cam area smaller, so lash caps are required under the buckets to make up the difference.
You can send in your cams to many cam companies for this.

We also sell cams already done for $400 a pair, including the caps.

[corylee316]

What are the specs on them. I want to know what is out there before I do any thing with my car. I have an idea of where I want to go but I also want to know what I'm getting myself into.

[corylee316]

I have read lots of posts on cams. Most of them have the word cam in them and have not bearing on what I am looking for.
If I wanted to just lay out money I would have two new cams cutom ground.

[supraracer49]

Turbo is cheaper!

[corylee316]

Where did you find these and what are the specs. I am curious b/c I am wanting to go faster and as far as NA goes cams and some head work are about it

[supraracer49]

Go Turbo!

[corylee316]

I was planing on the other stuff if I could get the cams. If there are no alternatives for cams then I'm going turbo

[supra90turbo]

My dad'a a master technican for Toyota and He did head work and a TRD cam in my truck. If your trying to get a lot of power out of an Na then these aren't the way to go. They are slightly modded but still legal for emissions in all 50 states. They get you more power but mostly at high RPMs. The prices are what he can get them for but as far as the genral public I have no idea on the prices. If you want some real power go with HKS but you will probably need computer work and different ingition.

Come on... this isn't a 22r. The cams available for 7M's are few and far between. TRD made some, they were Grp.A cams and think about spending $1000 for the pair if you're lucky.
HKS, again, made cams. But again, look to spend about the same as TRD.
Computer work and different ignition? ....

Regrinds are the way to go today. Either that or get a set of Brian Crower cams from the HPF group buy.

[Clip]

Come on... this isn't a 22r. The cams available for 7M's are few and far between. TRD made some, they were Grp.A cams and think about spending $1000 for the pair if you're lucky.
HKS, again, made cams. But again, look to spend about the same as TRD.
Computer work and different ignition? ....

Regrinds are the way to go today. Either that or get a set of Brian Crower cams from the HPF group buy.

:bigthumb:

but jesus, whats happening? this whole thread has just been a shitload of misinformation, save a few posts that said "use the search button"

[Ma70.Ent]

:bigthumb:

but jesus, whats happening? this whole thread has just been a shitload of misinformation, save a few posts that said "use the search button"

Well, I was right about there being no current cams for the N/A, so yeah. :icon_razz

[Clip]

Well, I was right about there being no current cams for the N/A, so yeah. :icon_razz

naw, Ma70, wasn't referring to you. :icon_mrgr

[Kai]

For information on cams - look here: http://users.tpg.com.au/users/loats/technical/7mge/camshafts.html

Also, Burton Power in the UK will do you a set of cams from scratch if you so choose. One-offs available.

[7MA61]

I am going to run the Brian Crower 272 and 9.52mm lift cams in my NA will see how they go, yes I know they are designed for a turbo engine.

TODA and Ted's are one of the few that still manufacture cams for 7mge's but they want about $1,000 Australia or $750 US a piece which is a joke.

[Kai]

£440 for cams isnt a lot - a Piper Cam kit costs £300 or so....

[7MA61]

£440 for cams isnt a lot - a Piper Cam kit costs £300 or so....
thats per cam so $2,000 all up:icon_evil

[Kai]

Worthless australian dollars! :D

[7MA61]

Worthless australian dollars! :D
Atleast we can play cricket:icon_razz , not to mention the price of fuel in the UK. Oh and we have this thing called the sun apparently it sheds light and warmth on our glorious beaches.:boobies:

[Kai]

*ahem* who won the ashes? Oh yes, thats right, us ;)

Fuel is going down here - down to 82p a litre now - thats a drop of 16p per litre since September :)

Sun? Overrated in my opinion! :D

[7MA61]

*ahem* who won the ashes? Oh yes, thats right, us ;)


Game 1 you guys are off to a flying start for a 5 nil white wash:naughty: .

You one the last series but that was the first in how many.

[NashMan]

call comp cams i got mine made there

[corylee316]

Thanks NashMan. They weren't $750 a peice were they?

[NashMan]

don't remmber

[NashMan]

it may have bena colt cams it's eather or

[GotToyota?]

They make TRD cams for the 7M-GE motor. About $100 a piece and they will get the job done. Another $200 for adjustable gears. When I get my Supra I will probably put them in it.
LOL, show me where I can get TRD cams for $100 a piece and I'm sold.

-Matt

[NashMan]

you can alot of cam shops will add mealt to the cam shaft aka welding that is whatv was done time mine so i don't have to deal with all that bs

ps i know they will ware out fast but who care's teh 7m will blow befor they ware out

[2slow4you]

www.deltacam.com (around $90 ea ground to your specs. I think most guys get a 272 cut and push a wet spray system)

Your best bet, aside from a pair of cams, is raising the compression with domed pistons, a good port n polish(and valve job), and aftermarket engine management. I've seen plenty of guys use high compression pistons with a good tune. Their n/a's ran like a cheeta on cocaine :)

[corylee316]

I tried e-mailing them with the e-mail address that is on their web site and I got a mail delivery problem. I tried two different e-mails(work and home) and got the same thing. They sound like they might be part of a solution for power NA style.

[2slow4you]

That's funny I've never had any issues with e-mailing them for a quote... try it again lol. Or maybe look them up in the yellowpages. I think they're in Washington, can't remember off the top of my head.

[corylee316]

They are in Tacoma. I will have to call. They don't like me doing that during work for some stupid reason. I tried again. For all I know it's our server here at work. It fiters out anything that resembles fun.

[GotToyota?]

I think 272 is abit extreme for your average, daily driven N/A. What # would be good for a more mild setup? I might look into this if it's only $200 for both regrinded.

-Matt

[corylee316]

If these guys are decent at what they do they should be able to figure out what will work well with the mods you have and what you have planned. I have a buddy that has one of those computer programs that you can adjust the cam specs, compression ratio, ect. and get at the flywheel guesstamate of what you should expect. I'm not to sure how accurate that it is, but I don't trust computers that much.

[GotToyota?]

Yeah, I wonder what a mild # would be, this website here can regrind your cams to either 244 or 230 degrees, the 244 is the more extreme, but I'd say that'd be a good goal to go for. Look @ the bottom of this link where it shows the 7M.

http://www.webcamshafts.com/pages/toyota-auto.html

[corylee316]

Those are rewelded. They add material and then grind it away. I don't have any expreiance with those. I'm sure someone will chime in on that. The other ones seem to be new grinds made from cam blanks. They seem to be better DD cams though.
**My e-mails did get through to them. I think my computer has some defects(maybe the opperator). Their number is 1-800-562-5500.**

[bigboost7m]

The Brian Crower kits are for both 7M's and are pretty reasonably priced, for the entire 272 kit its like $600, thats not bad considering your getting brand new cams. They also have other profiles, check out there website at briancrower.com!!!

[foreverpsycotic]

anyone have the specs for the NA cams, i pulled the numbers off of the Brian crower website for the 264s

264°/264° 220°/226° .336"/.332" 8.53/8.43

[2slow4you]

My buddy has been running a set of delta regrinds in his b18 Hon-Duh. Has roughly 10K miles on them and still in good condition.

Give them a call they can give you more options, I said 272 as that's a common grind for someone looking in to spraying their motor

If u can get the new cams, that's great too. It's x-mas time so a majority of my cash went in to presents lol

[corylee316]

For some reason I don't think that my girl will understand why she didn't get any toys. On the plus side she likes the way my car sounds. She's 5 so she is easily amused.

[Tire Shredder]

Ok,

I've called 6 different camshaft grinders in the US and Canada to get their opinions and thoughts on camshafts for the 7m-ge aswell as pricing.

like 935 motorsports said, camshaft regrgrinds reduce the overall size or "base circle" of the camshaft, while leaving the material on the tip. In effect, you can shape the camshaft any way you want. The amount of material removed from the "Heel" or "round" part of the cam is made up or "replaced" by pucks which are inserted underneath the stock valve shims. Think of the removed material as this new shim. more lift and any desired duration can be made this way. The restriction to how wild your cams are using the regrind method is restricted by how much lift. When the stock shims are built up too much to take care of this extra material, they can be spit out of their origonal seating position and bind, chewing up various valvetrain parts......this is BAD! so regrinds should generally be considered for mild upgrades.

High lift and and duration can be achieved with hard welded cams (material welded onto the stock cams and then ground to the desired shape (more expensive) or full billet cams ground from a chunk of metal.

I will be choosing reground cams because the head will not have to be modified, it's innexpensive and works well as I do not want to go too wild. These are frowned uppon in the domestic community because of the stock cam casting process doemstics use, only the outside of the cam is hardened and when ground to a specific profile, the usable life of the cam is greatly reduced. Toyota cams are hard all the way through, and I am told there should be no worry of the cam being damaged under normal use.

as for camshaft grinds....advertised duration means nothing. Every company uses a different basis for their cams. It all started when people started copying camshaft grinds mad be reuputable companies like crower and advertising them as more extreme durations saying "my 272 is much more streetable than your 264 and I have the same duration!" more sales were generated. Crower had enough of this and decided to introduced the standard of recording duration at a specific lift (50 thousandths of lift) this means that on every cam, when the cam is pushing 50thousandths, the angle of rotation to the other side of the cam at 50 thou is recorded....this elimantes any phony claims of duration.

That being said, you should only think in terms of duration at 50thou. I've called several camshaft grinders and have come to the conclusion that I will be getting cams from Jeff at Colt Cams:
#54 - 3347 262nd Street, Langley, BC V4W 3V9
Tel: (604)856-3571• Fax: (604)856-3572

he was EXTREMLEY helpful in explaining things to me and has done many camshaft grinds for the 4age lately (same head as the 7mge, just less two cylinders) he says he has been getting gains of over 25rwhp gains with his 223 @50 thou grind on those motors with supporting mods. It may hurt the low end slightly but not badly, slight lope at idle. Should generate power from 2000rpm to 6500rpm, generating power all over the band. His milder grind of 212 @50 thou is the same as the "mild" for the turbo motors, on the second stage their grinds differ due to more overlap on the NA motor. He says the motor should feel quite good in higher rpm. This cost for the more agressive grind is $689CDN with shims. the valves should be shimmed using toyota shims after installation, the intake side effects idle the most and should have special attention paid to it. He has never heard of spitting shims with this setup but this would be on his edge of caution....more than that may cause a worry.

Web Cams are a hardweld option and their recommended grind for the NA is 218 @50 thou .322 an cost $734US for both. I have talked to a local toronto member who has these installed. He had intake, exhaust, mild port work and a rebuilt motor and dynoed over 200whp he can't remember the exact number however. Idle was pretty much stock and he said when running with a mildly modded turbo car, no distance was gained by either.

For web Cam's regrinds you have to send them your cams so they can spec them along with what modifications are done to the motor, then they can recommend a grind.

Schneider cams has two flavours, 264 duration which is 210 @50 thou and 272s which are 222 @ 50 thou. he recommended the advertised duration of 272 for my application. Their cost is $100 a camshaft and $84 for shims. for me, shipping to Cali would be pretty high, and requires some investigation on my part. The grind on the schneider cams seems very similar to the Colt cams configuration. their contact info: Telephone: (619) 297-0227 Fax: (619) 297-0577 E-mail: Schneiderracingcam@sbcglobal.net Street Address: 1235 Cushman Ave. San Diego, CA. 92110

Shadbolt Cams: suggests 212 @50 thou with a .310 lift. He said Good street manners, with a good power increase. $500 CDN for the pair, with shims. You should call barry (owner) for confirmation of information. His notes were messy and didn't know much about hte 7mge at all.

Crower: not much info on this I have recorded that they were chargin $172USD for both and shims would be additional. I have a feeling that would be $172 each and my notes may be wrong, contact them for more information. he instructed me to put Attn: Dustin on the package and he would profile the stock cams and recommend what grind would be best.

Jeff at Colt cams is the only one that seems to have experience with our motors (and a large amount at that) and if at all possible I will be purchasing from him just from the sheer amount of customer service. I am opting for the more agressive reground cam option due to the streetability that the toronto member mentioned on the webcams and I am thinking if I am going to install cams, why not get the most gain possible without going insane.

as for tuning, the stock ECU may have troubles with cams...I'll be installing an LC-1 Wideband and a used SAFC along with an AFPR so ignition timing doesn't get all out of whack. MAFT-pro (rumoured to suppor the 7mge soon) or megasquirt would be better but I am trying to keep costs as low as possible.

hope that helps. I am just trying ot get a grip on all of this so if somebody more knowledgable on the forum wishes to correct me, feel free to do so.

Steve

[Sawbladz]

And THAT as they say...is how its done.

Nice work Steve. Thats alot of excellent info all in one post.

[Ma70.Ent]

I have stickied this thread. It has useful information and most N/A guys usually have questions on stuff that isn't the basic bolt ons.

[cuel]

http://www.supramania.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25481

Why not get these and a set of adjustable cam gears?

Edit: Nevermind.... BC's giving them the run around....

[935motorsports]

I am going with Schneider because they are local to me. Crower is also local, but I want to work with a smaller company that won't be as busy.

This way, I can use all my cores to get grinds done and have the cams IN STOCK for people that don't want to send theirs in first.

[7M-fanatic]

Megacycle Cams will weld-up, then grind to your specifications.
This maintains the correct base circle diameter.
They will not do anything for you if you don't have what spec.s you want.
They are not into marketing automotive cams.
They prefer to copy another cam.
I have never asked them what their service costs, but may soon, because I have one 264 7M cam that needs a mate.

Personally, I would never run 272 cams without going to shim-under buckets.
And absolutley not do it if using a re-ground cam with a small base circle.
The required shims to get the valve lash correct are VERY heavy!!

I have installed a TODA shim-under set in my NA head to run with 256 cams.
The car has been through the lights at 8000 RPM in second (auto/3.90 gears) already with stock cams & springs. Toysport thought stock springs are good for 7500, and may be on a turbo engine (boost pressure works against spring pressure, and lowers the RPM that the valve will float at).
It had no power up there, but it would not shift out of 2nd without lifting after I had the ECU modified. (all 3 clock crystals changed, but that is another story/can of worms)

I do have 272 cams to go into the Group-A head on my twin-charged 7M, but it also has shim-unders in it. But I plan on turning it to 10.000.

I now where there is a set of 256x11mm cams sitting, but the guy wants a lot for them.
When I do find cams in Japan (they are getting rare over there), I have to sell them for about $1200 a pair any more.

A LOT can be had just by playing with adjustable cam gears.
Retard both cams by 2-4 degrees, and you will move the power peak up several thousand RPM.
But you need everything else in the system bumped up to make this work.
Larget throttle, headers, big exhaust, etc..
(I would love to unload the pile of cam gears I have)

[7M-fanatic]

Well, I am going to absolutely forget about bringing in any more cams from Japan, seeing what the Brian Crower cams are selling for!

Now if I could just find a US made billet steel flywheel.......
(this does not include Fidanza aluminum, or the chinese junk on eRip)

[7M-fanatic]

Well, I am going to absolutely forget about bringing in any more cams from Japan, seeing what the Brian Crower cams are selling for.

Well, maybe not, seeing that the BC cams are failing to materialize.....

Are group buys like group sex ?
Everyone gets screwed ?

I guess, I had better start buying up all the HKS, JUN, and TODA cams I can find in Japan again.

[DEFIANT 7M]

One more http://tedcomponents.com/7mgte.htm

[7M-fanatic]

I have a set of custom stainless valves that were made longer, just to take up the slack when using re-ground cams, so that ultra-thick lash pads are not needed.
Overall length is 99.75mm.
They are new, never installed because I found TODA cams for both my engines.
If anyone is interrested, I would make someone a deal on them.