View Full Version : fuel lines/ system
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 06:07 PM
Ok, the supra just flat out died on me last thurs., no sputtering...etc. now I kno the engine isnt getting fuel and I just replaced the pump, and its still not getting fuel and I know the pump is getting power. Does anyone have any help for me or maybe a full diagram of the fuel lines? Im completely lost now.
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 06:45 PM
no one?
BosoMKII
04-29-2006, 06:53 PM
Just get under the car and follow the lines from the tank.
http://www.cygnusx1.net/supra/library/TSRM/fi/FI_092.html
Have you checked your fuel filter? And not because I think your stupid or anything, but just to be sure we can elimniate that variable; is there gas in the tank?
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 06:57 PM
yes, there is gas in the tank, and i changed one fuel filter, but there is a second one, right?
BosoMKII
04-29-2006, 07:26 PM
Don't know if there are two. The fuel pump has a filter/sock on it, and then there will be the normal fuel filter probably in the engine bay someplace ( no idea where on a Supra, haven't looked for it yet )
So, if your filter is clean, pump is new, have you actually tested for power at the pump? Maybe the relay is toast?
The Filter is mounted near the Diff in a Mk3.
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 08:18 PM
theres one up by the block under the intake manifold too
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 08:33 PM
No there isn't ;)
Well theres a cylnder with a banjo bolt and looks the exactly the same as a fuel filter with fuel lines going to it, someone else told me about it and they said they have replaced it before. and they showed it to me on mine. but now im getting even more confused now.
If you're talking about the thing bolted to the intake side engine mount it's just a Union there's nothing inside it.
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 08:44 PM
If you're talking about the thing bolted to the intake side engine mount it's just a Union there's nothing inside it.
Ok, om glad you told me that before I went and took my mani. apart. Maybe you can help me find my prob. then, Last thursday the supra completely cut out and died on me, and I can tell its not getting fuel to the engine, I thought it was the pump so i got a Walbro and got that installed and its still not getting fuel, and i know the pumps running. So could it be my FPR? Ive also checked all my fuses etc.
Start by doing a visual on the lines and make sure none have been crimped shut.
Someone here had badly blocked lines recently so that would be the next thing I'd check.
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 08:58 PM
Start by doing a visual on the lines and make sure none have been crimped shut.
Someone here had badly blocked lines recently so that would be the next thing I'd check.
thats what I thought at first, but the line that is on the intake manifold side is the return line right? because I pulled that off and cranked the engine and it shoots out off the block side so it seems to me that the FPR is stuck closed possibly? I dont think that the lines could be crimped shut because it was running perfectly fine then the shut off after driving for a good hour straight and wont start at all now.
Ok now I'm confused!
I thought you said the motor wasn't getting fuel?
So it has pressure at the rail?
Check the Injector fuse.
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 09:06 PM
Ok now I'm confused!
I thought you said the motor wasn't getting fuel?
So it has pressure at the rail?
Check the Injector fuse.
I've already checked every fuse, and maybe a little more info. would help, It was hard to start for a few days but still running fine, so i thought my starter was starting to go out because it was still running strong, but then on thurs. ( few days later) the car completely dies after an hour or so of driving and then wont start from then on, and after inspecting I realized it wasnt getting fuel anymore, so I replaced the pump and its still doing the same thing, oh and the fuel filter is new too.
<Jdub> Pulls up a lawn chair and pops a beer :icon_cool
BosoMKII
04-29-2006, 09:12 PM
What is it that you did that you feel sure the engine is not getting fuel?
Cranking can you hear the injectors firing?
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 09:20 PM
What is it that you did that you feel sure the engine is not getting fuel?
Because after cranking for a while if you smell under the hood you can smell the fuel from the starter injector. Plus the engine is cranking fine, and my alternator, plugs, wires, coil.. etc. are all new
Cranking can you hear the injectors firing?
Haven't checked that, Ive had to work on it by myself today, so I didnt have someone to crank it for me
hook up multimeter you can see from the drivers side
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 09:23 PM
hook up multimeter you can see from the drivers side
umm not quite sure what your talking about, and what should I be looking for from it?
Sorry was eating ;)!
Grab a MM set it to DC Volts put a probe into each of the 2 wires for the Injector and see if you get voltage there!
You should be able to sit the MM so you can do this on your own!
(A test light would work as well)
YourEnemy
04-29-2006, 09:46 PM
Sorry was eating ;)!
Grab a MM set it to DC Volts put a probe into each of the 2 wires for the Injector and see if you get voltage there!
You should be able to sit the MM so you can do this on your own!
(A test light would work as well)
ok do I have to turn the ign. on? and do I stick the probes in the injector or the plug?
Pull a plug and put the probes in there then crank the motor, we're looking for voltage at the Injector as if you have fuel at the rail the injector is the last place it could stop before it gets into the motor!
YourEnemy
04-30-2006, 05:27 PM
Pull a plug and put the probes in there then crank the motor, we're looking for voltage at the Injector as if you have fuel at the rail the injector is the last place it could stop before it gets into the motor!
Ok, pulled of one of the injector plugs and put the probes in the plug, cranked it, and didnt get a reading
Ok now go back and triple check the Injector Fuse ;)
YourEnemy
04-30-2006, 05:33 PM
ok, ill go do it right now is there a specific fuse for the injectors or just the EFI fuse?
Should just be the EFI fuse and I'm not sure if it has a relay or not (Standalone here)
Hopefully one of the guys that knows will jump in! <edit>
http://www.cygnusx1.net/supra/library/TSRM/fi/FI_109.gif
YourEnemy
04-30-2006, 06:08 PM
does anyone know where the two fusable links are?
YourEnemy
04-30-2006, 08:08 PM
no one?
Nick M
05-01-2006, 01:57 AM
does anyone know where the two fusable links are?
I suggest you read some of the FAQ's and follow the link to the Toyota Supra repair manual online, or TSRM. You will find the fusable links in the power distribution chart, and more specifically, in the component locator.
YourEnemy
05-01-2006, 02:17 PM
Ok, so i checked the relays, fuses, etc. and havent found anything wrong, Is there anything else that I need to check?
Has there been any work done on the car recently?
YourEnemy
05-01-2006, 04:44 PM
Has there been any work done on the car recently?
no, maybe some replacement parts a couple months ago but thats about it
Just trying to figure out what if anything has changed.
If there is power to the Injector Fuse then again at the relay there has to be a break in between. (you have checked for voltage at both these locations haven't you?)
Worst case scenario is a dead ECU but lets eliminate the easy/cheap stuff first.
cjsupra90
05-01-2006, 07:17 PM
does the Check engine light (MIL) come on when you turn the key all the way on, but not to the actual cranking point?
YourEnemy
05-01-2006, 08:05 PM
does the Check engine light (MIL) come on when you turn the key all the way on, but not to the actual cranking point?
actually it does
and IJ, now that i think about it i didnt check it at the fuse, do I pull the fuse out to check it there?
YourEnemy
05-02-2006, 05:21 PM
IJ! :1zhelp: lol
LMAO I thought you said you CHECKED it!! grrrrr
Pull the fuse put the MM probes across the fuse on continuity setting don't trust a visual!
Change the MM to V dc and test the fuse socket with the IGN on to see if you have power there (+ probe in socket and - to ground)
YourEnemy
05-02-2006, 05:57 PM
ok, I checked it at both spots myself this time, (my dad did it the first time) and aparently he was doing something wrong, because I am getting a reading and its coming up normal, I also managed to get ahold of a different FPR today and change that while I was at it, I can smell the fuel now after cranking it, but its still won't start i think my starter managed to go bad around the same time because it doesn't sound right and the battery is fully charged, or could my starter injector possibly going bad? does this sound logical to you?
BosoMKII
05-02-2006, 06:20 PM
You know the battery is fully charged? Have you tried a battery out of a working car?
My car would not start even if I jumped it the other day, but when I dropped in a known good battery ( out of a running car ) the motor turned over right away.
Just a thought. I like to eliminate as many variables as possible no matter how little they seem.
YourEnemy
05-02-2006, 08:20 PM
You know the battery is fully charged? Have you tried a battery out of a working car?
My car would not start even if I jumped it the other day, but when I dropped in a known good battery ( out of a running car ) the motor turned over right away.
Just a thought. I like to eliminate as many variables as possible no matter how little they seem.
yea, I actaully took it in to pep-boys and they used their machine on it to check and charge it
If you've been cranking it longer than 40 seconds at a time and not letting it cool down a bit you may have killed the starter! :( (Ask me how I know!)
Our starters have a stupid small motor with a reduction box so can't cope with extended cranking.
Joel W.
05-03-2006, 01:11 AM
Plus, if it does not start in 1-3 cranks, something is wrong...and your washing down the cylinders and rings..(if the injectors are pulsing)
Edit: After reading this entire thread, I would take 2 mins and pull the distributor cap and see if the rotor turns when the engine is cranked over. I am leaning towards a snapped timing belt.. Don't ask me why, it is just my hunch and it's an easy test.. :)
shaeff
05-03-2006, 05:07 AM
i didn't see (though i'm tired and just got home from work) any indication that he checked for spark? if he has air, can smell fuel, there's one thing left, and that's spark...
it might be a good idea to check that, too.
-shaeff
YourEnemy
05-03-2006, 09:49 PM
Ok, I finally got everything worked out, so I first thought it was the fuel pump, so I got a Walbro, installed it and still nothing (at least I won't have to do it later) . Turns out it was the FPR, but the reason why it wouldn't start after I changed it is aparently the resistor to my MSD coil got messed up. When I changed that today it fired right up in an instant, I also want to thank everyone for their help.:icon_bigg
LMAO Sorry I assumed when you said it had been running fine before the fuel issue that all that was touched was fuel! DOH!
YourEnemy
05-04-2006, 03:06 PM
Ok, just one more question, would changeing the FPR and the fuel pump to a walburo effect anything? now after Ive got everything fixed, the RPM's are seeming to lag a abit and not accel. as quick.
It may be a bit rich, you could try dropping the base fuel pressure a touch if the FPR is adjustable.
Did you drill out the J tube restriction?
YourEnemy
05-04-2006, 03:47 PM
It may be a bit rich, you could try dropping the base fuel pressure a touch if the FPR is adjustable.
Did you drill out the J tube restriction?
No, I just put in a stock one for now, when I get paid ill try to get a ajustable one
YourEnemy
05-04-2006, 05:20 PM
Part 2 of my question?
umm im not sure what you mean one the second question.
Did you drill out the J tube restriction?
YourEnemy
05-04-2006, 05:47 PM
Did you drill out the J tube restriction?
lol I mean Im not sure what you mean by that
If you follow the return line down to the block there is a bracket bolted to the side that has a bent pipe, this is the J Tube and has a small orrifice as a limp home thing with the stock pump in case of fuel system failure.
When you install a bigger pump there isn't enough flow in the return line due to this restriction and it can make you run rich.
YourEnemy
05-06-2006, 12:13 AM
If you follow the return line down to the block there is a bracket bolted to the side that has a bent pipe, this is the J Tube and has a small orrifice as a limp home thing with the stock pump in case of fuel system failure.
When you install a bigger pump there isn't enough flow in the return line due to this restriction and it can make you run rich.
ok, Ill be sure to do that when I get the chance, and about the ajustable FPR, I know this is cheap but would this work?http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/FUEL-PRESSURE-REGULATOR-BLUE-PRELUDE-COROLLA-SUPRA_W0QQitemZ8062601517QQcategoryZ33553QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Being 17 and not having much money I couldn't afford the kit off suprasport.com, but I dont want to get something thats not going to be safe or screw the supra up.
Try drilling the J Tube first it costs nothing and may cure it.
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