Where In the world did u manage to find the R-12? I'd like to completely swap everything over but it's not within my reach at the moment.AWESOME write-up... for time and money's sake i'll probably just get some Freeze-12. lol i really need to get my A/C running again.
PF condenser will work well with R12 refrigerant and improve performance. I have a PF condenser from American Condensers plus a large Spal pusher fan in my Supra running R12 and it has been working well.Would you be able to use a parallel flow condenser with R12 without reducing performance of the system?
I read somewhere that the speed of the coolant flow (the through put) could be reduced with a parallel flow condenser which apparently shouldn't be good with R12.
Is R12 better? (aside from the environmental part) if so I would gladly just stick with what my system is designed for if it makes it work better. Although I've never had AC in a Supra so anything is better at this point lolThe store. Freeze 12 isn't R12. You can still buy R12 its not hard to find.
It is just that I found this on a Mercedes forum:PF condenser will work well with R12 refrigerant and improve performance. I have a PF condenser from American Condensers plus a large Spal pusher fan in my Supra running R12 and it has been working well.
"When converting from R12 to R134a using a Parallel Flow model condenser greatly improves performance. Parallel Flow condensers can also be used with R12 and alternative refrigerants."
So in theory smaller room for liquid and lower flow speed and maybe higher pressure.the R12 refrigerant can use all the help it can get to remove heat from the cycle, but a parallel flow condenser has one drawback, there is little room for liquid storage. the fact that a reciever dryer is part of the system helps, so it SHOULD improve the situation. the problem I can envision is this: R12 needs compression, heat removal, and flow velocity to function properly. compression and heat removal are fine with a PFcondenser, but velocity is massively reduced. I think it should improve both efficiency and cooling capability to move up to the PF, but velocity may be deminished enough to cause a reduction in capacity.
before going to that expense, I'd remove the existing coil, flush it free of residue, and chemically clean the fins and tube surface to get maximum from it.
if this doesn't help, only then would I consider a PF
if your sig pic is your car, at least you have a light color paint on the car. I'd get ALL the windows professionally tinted the max you are allowed, and do what is allowed on the front as well.
Yes but it's the cost of the conversion I'm trying to avoid !i doubt youll see that much of a difference if any with R134a, assuming the conversion is done correctly.
If youre having to get a recharge, chances are your system is leaking anyways. I can see it losing a charge over a long period of time (20+ years) or from just sitting. Changing the components isn't rocket science, its easier than doing the head gasket. You can leave the recharging to a shop, but everything else you can do on your own.Having seen the guy with all the correct gear just do a pressure test and re-gas last time, doing a Conversion is not really something I'd be happy doing myself . . . and quite expensive to have done by a garage.
That's why I'd rather try and find out if there's a gas which is properly compatible with an R12 system . . . and get someone to re-gas it.
(the problem is that I've come to realise that, having phoned them, most of the garages who offer aircon servicing don't have a clue about older systems and the various different gases available)
No, as I said I lost all the gas due to an engine change. (the previous re-gas was just because it had never been re-gassed from new)If youre having to get a recharge, chances are your system is leaking anyways
That's what I figure . . . and why I'd rather stick with a gas that doesn't need any conversion workI remind those new to MVAC it requires tools and skills not possessed by the typical backyard mechanic
Yes I had also forgotten about the Oil issue . . .Freeze 12 is a combo of R134 and R142b so basically if you put it in an r12 system that uses mineral oil the oil will not flow with the R134 and your system will likely disintegrate
Well, both. It's illegal because it's flammable and it's flammable because it's a hydrocarbon. Or maybe I didn't follow.Are you suggesting it's illegal because it's a hydrocarbon or because it's Flammable?
The 142 is what carries the mineral oil. It's how F12 gets away with being a drop in. The problem is exactly what 3p stated. When that 142 leaks out (and it will before the 134) the oil stops circulating. The compressor then fails and sends derbies throughout the system. Not cheap or easy to fix.Freeze 12...It is a combo of R134 and R142b so basically if you put it in an r12 system that uses mineral oil the oil will not flow with the R134 and your system will likely disintegrate.
But lots of people say that R134a doesn't work well in R12 systems . . . apart from the mineral oil issue, it's at too low a pressure . . . plus you need all the connectors and O-rings changing, many say you need new hoses too.Point is rather than use 80% 134a (what F12 is) why not simply use 100% and put in the proper oil with it?
^ This.^ This.
On the other hand you can't go too far the other way. At minimum you'll need HNBR O rings (no need to do the compressor), flush the system, and use PAG oil.